Pakistan Govtn posiition is up to them. The Indian Govtn position is simple, in 1947 THE majority of the people NEVER backed the abominaion of evil partition, hence Kashmir is ancestral part of India, as per peoples wishes in prior to partition. These are irreconcilable differences.
RE:wake up hindus..
by Mind Clear on Apr 06, 2008 05:06 PM Permalink
There is nothing like this. It is all the figment of your imagination. All non-Islamic folks in the world are civilized and secular. Organized religion is organized madness. Accept the humanistic laws and gender equality which all developed countries follow and excel in integrating modernity, money, matters and equality. And to do so, one has to keep on pursuing science, technology, art, architecture, research, development, sports, medicine, creativity and communication. Religion is One. We are all 'Humans'. What matters in life is the level of your skills, competency, capacity & personality to deal with real issues, to make human life strong, intelligent, vibrant, rich in every dimension for which you push for excellence in education, economics and employment. Talk beyond all this is hypocrisy, waste of time, energy and humiliating oneself.
The only thing that makes pakistan viable as country is its stand against India, i.e muslim standing against Hindu India. Once the issue is solved, the very existence of pakistan will be questioned by the different people inside pakistan. Kashmir is the glue that hold pakistan together-so this issue can never go away.
India will never solve this issue either- because India has more to gain by bleeding pakistan very slowly- not to fast as to disintegrate pakistan- India does not want these muslim back either. But slow enough that pakistan remain a backward country/insignificant country. The US has been funding Pakistan economy for a very long time now- but thsi will stop one day or the other - as world policy change. China will back pakistan as a competition to India, but China cannnot backed pakistan too much either as its does not want pakistan to become a threat either to china itself - by pakistan being strong enough to support the huge muslim province of China. So China does not want this issue resolve either.
So pakistan is just stuck in this situation- so we will always see Pakistan raising the kashmir issue every time they need something to rally their whole country. And India wil encouraged them also to do that, because it makes political sense.
RE:Kashmir issue will never be solved
by Mind Clear on Apr 06, 2008 05:10 PM Permalink
There is nothing like this. It is all the figment of your imagination. All non-Islamic folks in the world are civilized and secular. Organized religion is organized madness. Accept the humanistic laws and gender equality which all developed countries follow and excel in integrating modernity, money, matters and equality. And to do so, one has to keep on pursuing science, technology, art, architecture, research, development, sports, medicine, creativity and communication. Religion is One. We are all 'Humans'. What matters in life is the level of your skills, competency, capacity & personality to deal with real issues, to make human life strong, intelligent, vibrant, rich in every dimension for which you push for excellence in education, economics and employment. Talk beyond all this is hypocrisy, waste of time, energy and humiliating oneself.
What exactly is the stand of Pakistan and India respectively as far as Kashmir goes? I am sure that as time passes the issue will get more and more convoluted since the origins of the dispute will pass out of memory. Both Nations are wasting precious time resources and lives on maintaining a status quo that does no good to the people of Kashmir. I am sure that like myself most persons do not know the detail of the stand originally taken by India and Pakistan. Popular lore (word of mouth) as I recall states that at the time of Independence for Pakistan and India from British rule the province of J&K had a largely Muslim population and a Hindu ruler Maharaja Hari Singh. The ruler had the option to integrate his province with India or Pakistan or stay independent. Apparently he most favoured the third option that is independence. Reprentatives from the future Union of India were trying to impress upon Hari Singh the benefits of integration with India but he was wavering and had not yet made a decision. Sensing that the Maharaja's decision might go against Pakistan and to force the issue the Pakistan Army instigated some groups of tribals to invade the province. The tribals with dreams of easy loot agreed. As soon as the tribals with Pakistan Army support invaded J&K and started looting and pillaging the Maharaja whose security forces were overwhelmed sent an urgent message to the Government of India for help. The Indian Government asked the Maharaja to sign an Instrument of
RE:Pak firm on its 'historic stand' on Kashmir
by Nirpinder Singh on Apr 06, 2008 04:22 PM Permalink
The Indian Government asked the Maharaja to sign an Instrument of Accession of J&K to India. This the Maharaja did and India air lifted platoons of its Army to Srinagar. The Indian Army was effective in halting the advance of the Pakistan Army/Tribal invaders. As soon as the Indian Army started pushing the invaders back Nehru was struck by a desire for international diplomacy and decided to take the dispute to the United Nations. Apparently the Army Officers of the Indian Army tried to convince Nehru to wait since they were confident of pushing the invaders back from all of the territory of J&K that had been occupied. However Nehru did not relent. As soon as the dispute reached the UN the Security Council decided that both sides (India and Pakistan) should observe a ceasefire and hold the positions that they occupied on the day of the ceasefire. Both sides agreed. The ceasefire position became what we today call the LOC or Line of Actual Control. Now what is the basis for the UN Resolution (of 1948 I believe) regarding J&K that is so oft quoted by Pakistan and what all has transpired in all of these years of "discussions" perhaps someone else will be so kind as to enlighten us
There is an ad on TV that explains how most TV Channel show programmes where the discussion is all "Blah! Blah! Blah!". This has an analogy with the Kashmir situation in that the general public is still waiting for the one channed that will be different and not all Blah! Myriads of Secretaries and Secretaries to Secretaries have made careers out of the situation as it exists with not resolution in sight. Perhaps it suit those in Office that no solution be found!
RE:Pak firm on its 'historic stand' on Kashmir
by IMPARTIAL on Apr 06, 2008 04:18 PM Permalink
Nirpinder, It is really wonderful. I do not know you but it seems that you have access to classified files on India and Pak's inner policy on Kashmir.THAT POLICY SEEMS TO BE "KEEP THE PROBLEM ALIVE" Few months ago one of my relative who is a 3-star army general told us that we can create a new Kashmir in the deserts of Rajsthan with 'amount of money we are spending directly and indirectly in one year'. He said he means it and it is understandable and agreeable to common man as well. He also told that Kashmir has no strategic importance even in changed world scenario.
At present, for India, to hold Kashmir is fulfilment of obligation to pro-india people of whole of J&K state and for Pak it is still a 'mean of survival' as it was on 14-08-47.
If Pak change its statement, they stand nowhere in islamic world and before their own hardliner public who really have made sacrifices.
It is high time for you guys in Pakistan, to patch up with India. Let there be a statesman.
Whatever solution that you want get it quickly.
Pakistans strategy should be to see that India do not go with USA. That makes India becoming an adversary to China. US does not need Pakistan in the long run. That makes Pakistan being dependent on China to counter India. China being developing-developed economy can not spare huge funds for Pakistan. USA too will not provide funds to Pak. IN its race of arms with India, Pak will internally bleed for resources as is happening for the last 60 years.
Win over India by aligning with it rather than fighting it.
The correct strategy is align with India and settle the Kashmir issue at status quo level except with a soft border at valley where two countries LoC meet. That is acceptable to India as it is already having a sort of autonomy through article 360 in its constitution. Kashmiris should also be happy at this deal, as it gives them the best possible deal under the circumstances. If they join Pak they have to suffer economically with no support coming from India. Keep the autonomy status and keep extracting sources from India.
Pak by alinging with India, can economically develop be pumping resources meant for defence. See that India, China will form an alliance with Pak as a junior partner. That gives Pak the support of China if India ditches.
Mullahs be told India is better than US. That also keep Indian Muslims secure
