Myth #14: The deal is not primarily about making money; it is about creating a new U.S. strategic relationship in south Asia.
Fact: The deal is primarily about making money. The main effect of the deal will be to pardon India – to remove it as a violator of international norms. After such a change in status, there will be no impediment to U.S. arms sales. This is where the real money is, not in nuclear reactors. U.S. exporters have mentioned selling as much as $1.4 billion worth of Boeing airliners, hundreds of F-16 or F/A-18 fighter jets, as well as maritime surveillance planes, advanced radar, helicopters, missile defense and other equipment. The Russian press has even complained that the nuclear deal is a ploy to squeeze Russia out of the Indian arms market.
their 123 agreement clearly spells out in black and white that both parties must honor the agreement regardless of whatever happens, including the compulsions of their domestic politics and laws. by contrast, the bush administration has said several times that usa is bound by the hyde act on this nuke deal in the discharge of the american obligations. the gandhis will sell india down the tube.
RE:chinese are smart
by santosh satpathy on Jul 14, 2008 12:10 AM Permalink
China is nuclear weapon state while India isnt,its even didnt sign NPT.Anyway India too hav better deal many other aspects compared to 123chinise one.Go,read the article once again before toeing the BJP blindly
The whole thing is economics. It makes economic sense for all concerned. For India; to lessen dependence on oil to some extent, more importantly the advantage is strategic with International ramifications - We would come out of nuclear isolation, It is acceptance of India as a nuclear power (Military reactors are excluded from IAEA safegaurds). We would get access to advanced technology. With right amount of arm twisting we can get some military production outsourced to India. Yes USA would get to supply nuclear reactors & Technology arms and airplanes. But then we need them.
Left's opposition is mainly because we would become more powerful than China; Rather we become an alternative to China in International strategic considerations. And as an Indian I don't want to be inferior to anybody
RE:Indo US Nuclear deal
by Gopal on Jul 14, 2008 12:03 AM Permalink
All these halla-ballu is in the name of nuclear energy that would flow after a decade or more investing huge capital at the moment. And after 30-40 years it require astronomically huge capital to decommission the nuclear plants constructed now. Google 'Group up for £17bn Sellafield job '. Do we need to put our children in great distress for the energy we use. 17 Billion sterling pound is Rs13,50,000 crores. The radiation hazard is another issue. It is time to think of the projects in depth.
Further the visionaries of the N-deal claiming to be Congress men went and signed an agreement which will make India to follow a LAW enacted by another country. Congress, founded in 1885 by AO HUME and others grows into a movement for freedom of India delivered freedom to India with sacrifices from martyrs from all over India. It up-held the democratic values from the very beginning. What happened now? Now they do not care about the values that sustained Congress/India all these years. A man was asked to sign the 'agreement' keeping it secret even the from AICC members. Leave alone the Parliament. What a pity!! Feel that the Congress will have to pay a heavy price for this undemocratic, dictatorial, unprincipled handling of the N-deal. Think twice before jumping into the fire.
Myth #11: India needs more nuclear power to assure its energy future.
Fact: Nuclear power has been virtually insignificant in India’s energy mix in the past, and will be no more important in the future. India has been generating electricity with nuclear reactors for more than 40 years. Yet, reactors supply only 2% to 3% of its electricity today. India has not built more reactors because they have not turned out to be as safe, or as clean, or – most important – as economical as originally thought. Even if India were to achieve a 50% increase in nuclear power generation (which is unlikely) such a step would only increase India’s overall electricity output by one percent at most, and would only increase India’s overall energy output by a fraction of one percent. That is not a significant increase in the energy available to India and would not decrease India’s demand for oil and gas.
Myth #14: The deal is not primarily about making money; it is about creating a new U.S. strategic relationship in south Asia.
Fact: The deal is primarily about making money. The main effect of the deal will be to pardon India – to remove it as a violator of international norms. After such a change in status, there will be no impediment to U.S. arms sales. This is where the real money is, not in nuclear reactors. U.S. exporters have mentioned selling as much as $1.4 billion worth of Boeing airliners, hundreds of F-16 or F/A-18 fighter jets, as well as maritime surveillance planes, advan
RE:Myth #11: India needs more nuclear power to assure its energy future.
by Gopal on Jul 13, 2008 11:42 PM Permalink
All these halla ballu is for the sake of 6800MW of nuclear energy by 2020. ie 3% of total. Energy starts flowing in 2020. At the present rate of inflation it will cost Rs20/- per unit. Taking into account the decommissioning corpus fund the cost will be Rs30-40 per unit. This is from Uranium which is being depleted fast and will reach the end by 2070. As it becomes scarce it is natural that the Uranium price will be exorbitantly high making the nuclear power uneconomical and financially un-viable. Congress released a document projecting the energy needs of India. Read Times of India 9.7.08. “Congress releases document on nuke deal's importance”. India wants to generate 26% of total in 2050. That is around 120000MW. Can anyone imagine the total cost of projects and the decommissioning cost burdened on our children to build such a huge capacity addition by 2050? Is it a realistic projection? Remember Uranium deposit will be depleting at faster rate. This does not stand to logic. Why does the congress come out with such false/unrealistic/misleading documents? Whom do they want to fool? Smells -some negotiation is in the pipe-line. The above document can be used to substantiate the financial viability. Beware Indians!! Read posting of the Reporter in this thread!!:) Which Indian company is involved in the various decommissioning works.
RE:Myth #11: India needs more nuclear power to assure its energy future.
by mahesh on Jul 13, 2008 10:24 PM Permalink
ur facts are shit @ India has not built more reactors because they have not turned out to be as safe, or as clean, or – most important – as economical as originally thought. ANS: here technology matters dear and fuel @ 50 % increase really u dont know wht is nuclear energy and advantages as comparison to other , ask any science student
@making money definitely money is there but if this deal happens think abt its advantages atatergig alliance is more important than money
The details covered above are already known to almost one and all in this country. But, the style in whcih this deal is being forced on the countrymen of today and next generations to come, has evoked substantil doubts on the PM of the country, and now on his government and the party to whcih he belongs.
RE:The Indo-US nuclear deal explained
by Rajendra Nayak on Jul 13, 2008 10:44 PM Permalink
The best part of Indian democracy is only 40 to 50% of the voters vote and all the elected MPs together have only 20 to 30% of the votes polled. They decide for 1 billion plus people. What is said is correct by Mr. Kamath. The deal is forced on the countrymen. More than all this, there is criminal waste of time by protests, stalling the parliament. There is a depression among the investors. Share market and other markets have gone worst due to the threats of election. Is N-deal is so important to topple the government when the questionable democratic US candidate Obama says he has no problems and if elected he will get it passed. So why our PM is creating a gloom in the market. The trust want may go against Congress because a single MP also demands in millions for his constituency development or asking for favour which will run into huge amounts. People donot want election because the inflation may touch 20 to 25% due to the spending of 30K crores or so.
RE:The Indo-US nuclear deal explained
by vinay on Jul 14, 2008 12:46 AM Permalink
share market is down not for the n-deal issue but due to fall in growth rate, due to inflation and rise in oil prices.
In the prospective war for energy between India and China, we need the nuclear power. Is there any person, whehter rich or poor, free from frequent power cuts and failures? In delhi, up, bihar, assam or even in Marxist ruled West bengal and Kerala, the fate of the poor man is same.groaping in the darkness, because of monsoon's failure! is there any alternative? we know that india is making gigantic strides in her economic growth and why we loose many of the FDI to China is the assurance of perennial flow of power/ electricity to the industrial units by China. The situation in future is going to be worse as India scrambles for more and more energy. According to recent estimates petrol prices are going to touch $ 200. How will be able quench our thirst for energy? If India does not clinch this deal soon, India will be lagging far behind China. It is an issue that touch common man too, because every one needs electricity.
Majority of Power Shortages till date Are Only due to Political Corruption, Court Cases and related Delays.
Another reason is LACK of TALENT in the SEBs as the Best Talent even after joining has left to Private Sector to avoid unneccessary problems with Quotawalas in work and promotions.
Third is, Vanishing of Village Tanks and Lakes By Encroachers Which decreased the Ground Water Levels and Made the Water Drain into the Sea. That Resulted in More Power Requirement in Agriculture Sector And Also More Demand of Water for Domestic Consumption.
Lack of Water Harvesting resulted in Increased Temperatures Which Made ACs and Coolers a Neccessity. I found In everybodies House the Power Bills are double in houses with Coolers And 6 times in houses with ACs.
Meaning Manifolds of Increase in Power Demand. By Spending Rs. 35000 Crores to Dig Village Tanks/Lakes which will take less than 2 yrs, We can decrease the Load of Agri Sector as well as the Domestic Demand in Summers to 1/3 or 1/4.
We Don't need to go for N Deal and Increase our N Energy Component Which will only be delivered if At all AFTER 8/10 yrs.
RE:INDO US NUCLEAR DEAL
by Anupam Chakrabarti on Jul 13, 2008 09:18 PM Permalink
Do you seriously think India with her (proudly) growing population can ever cater to her power problems by N-means?
RE:INDO US NUCLEAR DEAL
by siba das on Jul 14, 2008 02:01 AM Permalink
Yes india will definitely made it..but everybody wants a easy way.... thats what they are doing....I don't know what will happen...but this definitely shows that we are not capble enough to rule ourselves... thanks Si das
It is good to go ahead finalizing the deal and removing the nuclear APARTHEID SITUATION for India even in the interest of running old nuclear power plants and revamping them to the state of the art level The deal is a significant though nuclear energy is to remain quantitatively smaller component for number of startegic reasons. However to bolster the energy security India should not delay the Iran-Pakistan Gas Pipe line any further. The pieline will be laid where materials and contractors will come from US and Europe and may be some international contractors will maintain and operate it. Th Iran-Pakistan 0India gas pipe line will be truly an onternational pieline with stake holders both from the developed and developing world. USA will be better secured with India becoming energy secure by gas pipe line as number of Indian going to USA will decrease with boom in economy due gas avalability.
I fail to understand as to why US and Israel keep on adverse relations with Palestine and some other states in the middle east. It appears that America will not be satified using divide and rule tactics till it is divided and broken. America must have known that arms superiority does never lead to victory be it Vietnam, Iraq, or internal dessentions within the country. With combined power of OECD countries the planetcan be free of wars theats within six months they sit back and decide. We the Asians (includes china and India) seek the magnanimity of USA to work for harmony among
RE:Nuclear Deal and Energy Security in Asia is Security of USA
by Gopal on Jul 13, 2008 11:33 PM Permalink
Friend, Please see the contentious issues in the Hyde act 1. No freedom to handle spent fuel. 2. No guarantee for alternate fuel supply 3. India is not a technology developer but a recepient. 4. India to side with US in NPT 5. India to participate with US National Security Administration for NPT. 6. Reporting of US President on the efforts of India in containing IRAN. 7. India denied space related dual use technology 8. India denied strategic planning of nuclear programms. 9. Stopped India in the production of fissile materials. 10.No joint move for universal nuclear disarmament. 11.All future agreeents are to be in consistent with this act. Hyde act is the enabling act for the 123 agreement.
Leaders declare that all these are wrong but failed to arrange a debate in Parliament. LEFT and BJP failed in the parliament to expose the omissions
Is it not surrendering our freedom and sovereignty?
What worries about this deal is the lack of clarity. I always had certain questions? Why was the government keeping the deal under wraps (even taking the risk of losing power)?Okay, I buy the point that it was for preventing any reactions for anti- proliferation protestors (but difficult to digest). I agree this deal would solve our power needs (or will it?) How fast will we see the effects of this deal? Immediately …? Or after 10 to 20 years? What about our current needs? The government is marketing the benefits of the deal. But, it does talk of any compromises that have been made or even the risks that are foreseen. Is US is so happy with us that it is giving us a free gift? In this materialistic world, there can never be free lunches. How is US benefitting from this? After having an inkling of how US pushes for its agreements by having agents in foreign offices like PMO or NSA. I would want to be amply sure this is not one of those cases. Is there any individual or Office or Party who would take the responsibility of consequences (not just the credit) of this deal? Or we would have to rue about a failed foreign policy decision for a long time to come Please don’t tag me as a commie or BJP@#*. I am just an ordinary Indian citizen who wants to gets his doubts clarified. The deal in its content certainly looks attractive. Please do comment if my fears are baseless.
RE:My reservations ....
by Gopal on Jul 13, 2008 10:58 PM Permalink
Very nice observations Mr.Santosh. Keeping it under wrap on some pretext is allowed but they can not keep it away from the AICC members and ruling partners. Will any one agree to 'sign off' our freedom? Read Mr.Bhadrakumar's interview. The energy from this deal will flow after a decade. It cost Rs20/ per kwh. Taking into account the decommissioning cost it will not be less than Rs40/- Our current needs are projected without any logic. Look at the projection given by the congress. 500-600 thousand MW by 2030. ABSURD!! No country will try to make another country prosper at their cost. Read”The nuclear deal's essence is politics”. It appears that US is more interested in the deal than India. May be they find it the opportune time to manage it.:) The repercussions of this deal, mainly the 2005 declaration and Hyde act will be perpetual dependence. No freedom of thinking and to act according to our consciousness either in foreign policy or in nuclear programmes. I am for a N-deal. But not in the present form. Let their be a deal befitting the sovereignty of two countries. I am not against nuclear energy. Take it up after serious studies.
RE:My reservations ....
by prabhat mohanty on Jul 13, 2008 07:45 PM Permalink
- Your attempt to question the deal is exactly what BJP and Communists are doing.
Don't get me wrong.
I am not not abusing. [ "Report abuse" has already been disabled by the Rediff moderator.]
Let me explain why I think so.
I genuinely believe, Rediff Board is for interactive particpation.
A continiuum.
People post questions. Some others answer.
Good or bad we learn. And move on.
If we have new questions, again we post and others answer.
But sometime some people are "stuck up" at one point.
Sometimes unknowingly.
And mostly "knowingly".
And they pretend not to have their answers.
There is a saying "you can never wake up a man who is already woken up and pretend to sleep".
Now why do I categorize you in this manner?
Because, you posted the same message before. There has been debates on your posting. And then again you come back and innocently ask the same questions as if you did not go through the whole debate on the forum , newspapers and T.V.
You pretend and ask the same "basic questions" and refuse to move forward.
Now, the Left and BJP are doing the same thing.
They raise a question.UPA answers.
Then they go quiet for sometime.
Then again they come back and raise the same question again.
Again people try to answer them.
They go quiet and again come back to ask the same question.
See, I told you one can never wake up a person, if he pretends to sleep.
RE:My reservations ....
by Santosh on Jul 13, 2008 10:36 PM Permalink
I was struggling with my link when i posted MY earlier post.Really sorry about that. I admire the way you have tried to put your point. But believe me people would stop raising questions if they are answered. i may be a bit ignorant but i believe these questions have not been still answered as you claim. Let me tell you my friend nothing helps in a situation like this more than a bit of clsrity and transparency especially when there is so much at stake. I and you would not have to argue day and night if there had been clarity. Can you claim that you know every bit of that is happening? I bet nobody can.
RE:My reservations ....
by mahesh on Jul 13, 2008 10:09 PM Permalink
dear difinitely nuclear deal is india favour, it will difinitely solve our future energy needs
why US is doing this ? 1)they need a solid statergic partner in asia
