>>>Valmiki proudly says to Ram, 'I am the 10th son of Pracheta, and I never remember speaking even one untrue sentence'. How can such a missionary and follower of truth could have written an imaginary story of Ram?
God must know all and should know about valmik. Ram was not god, he could have been a good king, ruler etc, but certainly not god.
>>>6. Even if by default we accept that Ram and Ramayana are the imagination of a poet, then at least we accept that the poet was real and lived on this earth, and was not imaginary. No one has ever doubted that Valmiki lived. His life has been chronicled in detail in Skand Puran, Bhavishya Puran and Adhyatma Ramayana. When Valmiki meets Ram for the first time, he says, as given in Valmiki Ramayana (7.96.19):
Just because the author existed, does his novel become true, then what about the present time fiction, is it all true. The writer of this article has illogical thinking.
>>> When a man has begun to be ashamed of his ancestors and his past, the end has come'.
Why should i not question my ancestors?? Why should i glorify wrongs/crimes of my ancestors or not be ashamed of them?? this is twisted logic without any reason. the author is doing double talk, just to justify his writing. Very far from truth.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Eternal Sunshine on Apr 15, 2008 04:04 PM Permalink
Be it as a manifestation of God or simply as a legendary hero of myths and folktales, Rama is an immensely revered and inspirational figure to people across the Indian subcontinent and South East Asia, as well as increasingly across Western civilization, where the Hindu epics and values are gaining recognition and popularity. In Jainism, Rama is enumerated among the nine white Balas. He is revered in Sikhism,(in the Guru Granth Sahib)[citation needed]
Rama is a great hero to the adherents of Agama Hindu Dharma and to the Muslims who practice Abangan, a syncretic form of Islam and Hinduism, in Indonesia. He is revered by the people of Thailand, Malaysia, Myanmar, Cambodia and Vietnam, who otherwise adhere to different forms of Buddhism, Islam and Hinduism. The Rama Leela is performed across South East Asia in numerous local languages and the story has been the subject of art, architecture, music, folk dance and sculpture. The ancient city of Ayutthaya stands in Thailand, as the tribute of an ancient Thai kingdom to the great legend. Many ancient and medieval era kings of South East Asia have adopted Rama as their name.
A Buddhist version of the tale is found in the Jataka stories, in the Dasharatha Jataka (Jataka Atthakatha 461) in the Pali vernacular. Here Rama is represented as a former life of the Buddha as a Bodhisatva and supreme Dharma King of great wisdom. In the Buddhist tale, he is the king of Varanasi and not Ayodhya, which is traditionally the capital of Kosal
RE:RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Eternal Sunshine on Apr 15, 2008 04:06 PM Permalink
Just gathering material from here and there so you stop targetting only the author of this article. :):):)
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Manjula A on Apr 15, 2008 01:29 PM Permalink
When a man has begun to be ashamed of his ancestors and his past, the end has come.
This is the only reasons the Aryans don't want to face the historic truth of the shameless deeds of their ancestors. They will go to any extent of fraud, invent seals like that criminal Rajaraman did and live in denial of the obvious truth. Because they don't want to be ashameed of thier ancestors. But the fact remains that the ancestors of the Aryans have done shameful deeds. May Shiv Shambhu give them courage to accept the truth.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Kris iyer on Apr 15, 2008 01:46 PM Permalink
Rajadhi,Raja,Rajendra Chola, The main issue is: How does one prove, then connect with God? Unfortunately, we cannot ring him up on his mobile to make an appointment to go See Him/Her/It. Take Chola's logic into this interview: "Hai, Dude, whoever you are, please convince us you are God". The Palestinian religions of Judaism, Christianity and Arabian religion of Islam rely wholly on "Prophets", who had performed many miracles, had dealt with Angels, had many extraordinary qualities about them, signifying their connection with God. Some were born out of virgins, some went to Heaven leaving no dead body behind and so on. Likewise, Hindus too saw God's Influence in many human heroes, so they called them Avatars. As in the other religions, the Hindu Avatars had performed extra-ordinary deeds, in their human form. The only difference between Hinduism and the other religions is that, Hindus did not record in writing all the details, then call just ONE book a HOLY BOOK. They did not call The Ramayana, the ONLY HOLY BOOK. The MahaBharata, The Bhagavadam, The Puranas and the Great Gita, are ALL HOLY Books of Hinduism. Hindus let ordinary people, re-enact the life-history of their "divine" heroes in the form of popular narrations, using songs and drama. Hindus do not mind movies made out of these Avatars. Unlike the Palentinian religions, Hindus mix art and religion, freely. Whereas a Holy Book is taken seriously, the art forms of song and dance is dismissed as special anthropology.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by RRRChola on Apr 15, 2008 02:13 PM Permalink
kris, appreciate your reply. we worship the avatars or god? if ram was an avatar, he is not god, then who is god?, why ram should be worshipped? tell me about the images, where did the rams image come from? is it part of anthrpology?
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Eternal Sunshine on Apr 15, 2008 03:53 PM Permalink
NO it's not a part of anthropology. I suppose you are doctorate in that subject so you would know better. This is just the faith of the believers.
And yes, we worship both Avatars and God(though I do not know about you). God is the supreme power to whom Rama himself bowed to. Open your mind's eye and you will see, God is everywhere. Nobody is forcing you to worship Rama at gun-point. Believing in Shiva/Jesus/Allah is entirely a personal decision, so please refrain from asking unnecessary questions. We are not the slightest bit inquisitive about who you are bowing to.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by RRRChola on Apr 15, 2008 05:09 PM Permalink
Dear Sunshine, no, i am not into anthropology, i think you are offended by my comments, it was not my intention. Non offense meant to anyone be it a Hindu, Muslim, Xian or any other faith. Nor anyone is forcing me to believe in any faith. Its my own quest to know the truth or to say know myself better.
I do not agree with 'dont ask questions' attitude - it could be something to hide or weak faith or lack of knowledge. You say ram bowed to god, could you give me references on this please.
RE:RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Eternal Sunshine on Apr 16, 2008 07:26 AM Permalink
It's always better if you get a Guru as TP suggested. Thanks.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Eternal Sunshine on Apr 16, 2008 07:24 AM Permalink
Dear RRRChola,
All my life I have seen that people of all other religions get very defensive when someone questions their faith. So,I am not the odd one here who is taking offence at your queries. If you are really in search of knowledge I would not show a 'don't ask questions' attitude. But it is ridiculous to bring anthropology into it, you should realise this.
Ramayana, Mahabharata, the Vedas, the Upanishads - are among the longest pieces of literature in the world. It needs a lot of study to explicitly understand every story therein. You cannot keep asking questions in a forum and expect people to have their patience and teach you from scratch. Hence I told you to refrain from asking unnecessary questions - not because I am scared of answering them, but because you should learn in the right way AND with respect.
"something to hide or weak faith or lack of knowledge"?
- I would not claim to have memorised all these holy books by my heart, so in case I am not aware of the answers I will say that out straight to you, you won't have to guess my lack of knowlegde. Learning is a never-ending process, and I am not ashamed to admit that my knowledge is not exhaustive. The person who thinks he knows everything, is the biggest fool.
Regarding your other query, Rama bowed to the Sun God and also Durga/Shakti, as per my knowledge of Ramayana. If you have read it as much as I did (which is very little), you would have known at least this. But it's always better if y
RE:RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by TP on Apr 15, 2008 11:31 PM Permalink
Dear RRR Chola, Asking questions is all right, but as the Bhagvad Gita says that the questions have to be asked from the right person with the right attitude. As far as your questions about self realisation or knowing your self and God are concerned, you will have to search for a Guru who is self realised and submit to him, serve him and then inquire from him submissively, not with a challenging attitude, because that will not help. If you think then it is just like any other material subject, but because this subject is spiritual, it needs something more and that is mercy of the Guru. I don't know if I have answered your question but my email id is tp0311@yahoo.com, if you need to discuss this further.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by Kris iyer on Apr 16, 2008 05:37 PM Permalink
Dear RRRChola, Like TP and Eternal Sunshine, I am now happy that you are a genuine inquirer. At first, I thought you were one of those "rationalists" from TamilNadu, who blindly attack Hinduism from all angles, tramping on the Ramayana, in particular. I am sorry, I misunderstood you first. I agree with both TP and Eternal Sunshine, in their comments to you. We wish we could help you a lot more.
With Hinduism, you will find that, as the oldest religion in the world, it has accumulated many, many explanations over several generations. It has not sought to "standardise" even important notions, such as God-head, worshipping through either Pooja or meditation and so on. But, remarkably, on their own, Hindus have come to a standard, throughout this world. Now Hindus live in almost every major country in this world. Therefore, it does take some patient study of some good books and attending "Upanyasas" by learned Gurus. May I suggest, you start with Rajaji's Tamil version of the Ramayana, "Chakravarthi ThiruMagan" or any of "Cho" Ramaswamy's books on Hinduism. Kavignar Kannadasan's "Artrhamulla Hindu Madham" is very very good for people of all ages and outlooks. Please visit the book shop at Mylapore: Ramakrishna Book Depot. You can also spend time at the Library of Ramakrishna Matam in T'Nagar Chennai. At Uththandi, near Chennai, you can listen to Swami Sudhbhavananda on his discourses. Both in English and Tamil, since you know both languages well, you will find many books.
RE:Inconsistencies, bad, too bad.
by mani sals on Apr 16, 2008 07:53 AM Permalink
Just teh same reason why you would fast when Amitabha baccahn or sharu khan is in problem... You see.. its we who make humans god. God is truth and every religion is based on falsification. No one dares to question teh truth... you will have all teh imple answers if truth was to be told.
