Yest another cheap publicity stunt pulled over by so called Kalingad.People know what kind of a person he is and people also know his associates.I would rather not mention their caste and religion and how people describe them.Empty vessels make most noise.Such vessels should be thrown out of the house.Such people never come up in life and never allow other people to come up in life.
Re: Barking Dogs???...Most common in India
by k j on Sep 09, 2008 02:31 PM Permalink
I have a fit name for that maney eater.I dont want to use it over the internet.Leave the old man alone.Buddha ho gaya hai.Akal ghaas charne chale gaye hai.
We need this Aryan Dravidian crap - it's main use is to have a dig at Guys living up North. Even if its true - and Hindusim is a mixture of Drvaidian, Indus valley Civilization and Aryan vedic- does it matter now.
All that matter is that we are all Hindus.
And at the same time we have the bonus of winding each other up with this dravidian Aryan stuff , take the piss but in a fun way- and nobody get upset or physically harm - then keep this Aryan dravidian stuff going.
By the way- kanadigas are cheap SW copies of Tamils - this has been proven scientifically. :-)
RE:We need this Aryan Dravidian crap
by tamil boy on Aug 05, 2008 04:25 AM Permalink
Dravidian - in context - does not mean a race or an ethnic people - it currently means Tamil politics. i.e. getting elected. In the Past - dravidian also included more than just Tamils In TN - e.g. like in ancient Rome - the empire was called the Roman empire - and then it disintegrated and languages evolved from old Roman langauge. Similarly - Dravidian or old Tamil was an old culture and language - which evolved into different derivative of old Tamil. Modern Tamil is one of these derivative, and is called Tamil because it is closest to this old langauge.
I think you are confusing local politics, what Dravidian actually means, and Tamil or Southy Indian history. South India History is not really well known outside TN and the West, the west because of the colonial past, trades with ancient Egypt, ancient Greece, Ancient Rome etc....
Dravidian religion - mean old Tamil relgion which mean sivaism which mean hindusim.
So people arguing about the difference about Dravidian, Aryan and Hindusim as religions are comparing sky blue, ocean blue, and navy blue - and arguing that they are not blue. They are not the same blue, but they are just blue witrh nminor diiferences- our enemies will amplify these differences - but us as educated Indian we have to be able to enjoy the different facet of the same colour. So guys down South use your brain.
RE:We need this Aryan Dravidian crap
by ThoondilKaaran on Aug 05, 2008 06:08 AM Permalink
Since you know about Sivaism, please enlighten me about what is said about Caste in Sivaism?
Re: RE:We need this Aryan Dravidian crap
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:15 PM Permalink
Saivism and siva is distorted form of Sramanic system ( aborginal dravidian system) which is non-vedic. Refer latest research worldwide, which is missing from brahmin written distorted history in india.
Re: We need this Aryan Dravidian crap
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:13 PM Permalink
Dravidians were never hindus, they were forcibly made dalits by crafty brahmins. Brahmnism came from foreign, where as aborginal dravidians were non-vedic.
Trust the historians and archaelogist, none of vedic god or vedic evidence was found in indus valley, though brahmins are good enough in painting every thing with vedic brush....
Today red indians are slave to white in america, australia, same way dravidians were made slave by brahmins(aryans) from europe around 3500 years ago.... Today most draividians are dalits, slaves and backward and their temples and heritage were converted. Modern historical research proved that DRavidians followed sramanic systems. Their temples are conveted to vedic and that is the reason why most hindu gods in present south temples are fully covered to hide identity. Remove cloths and jewellary from one deity of famous god from famous temple, it will be proven by itself.
I hope hindu fanatics doesn;t come up and say this is insult, but sir history and facts are real, rest is all bogus.....
RE:just nuke the a*sshole tamils or give the land to sri lanka to wipe the ugly black tamils out. LOL
by Vish on Aug 04, 2008 08:28 PM Permalink
It's not fair to characterize all Tamils. This treatment should be reserved for this MTHRCHUD Karunanidhi's followers. They're in fact spreading this N vs S shit.
RE:RE:just nuke the a*sshole tamils or give the land to sri lanka to wipe the ugly black tamils out. LOL
by tamil boy on Aug 05, 2008 12:04 AM Permalink
I bet U this nasty post was written by a kanadiga imbecile who still use shoe polish instead of face cream and thinks he is white. :-)
It is Karma. If Brahmins have done evil in the past they will reap the harvest today. And thos doing evil against them today will reap the rewards in future.
The agenda of these so-called rationalists, bt actually hate-filled people must be exposed, but we need not lose our head in doing so.
RE:MTHRCHUD Karunanidhi!
by Vish on Aug 04, 2008 09:00 PM Permalink
I talks volumes about ALL of us if we don't learn from thousands of years of slavery to foreigners. This casteism was the BIGGEST factor. Everybody looses if we keep talking Brahmins vs us and vice versa.
Re: RE:MTHRCHUD Karunanidhi!
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:19 PM Permalink
DRavidians are aborginals of india who are non-hindus, where as brahmins are from europe came here 3500 years ago with vedic system which is known as hinduism today. named by britishers... Hell with unscintific vedic system, dowry system, believing imaginary gods and superstitions. brahmins bought misery for rest and big stomach for themselves, who ate lot on the name of gods. they created many gods to get more and more food on the name of god, doing nothing. brahmins are crafty idiots. They will be gone with latest historical research. They even diluted historical facts of mass murder of 10000s of dravidians during bhakti movement.
If one accepts the Aryan Invasion Theory -- which states that tribes invading from Persia displaced the original inhabitants of the Indus Valley whoo moved into southern India -- there is evidence showing that Siva was worshipped by the inhabitants of the Indus Valley.
The invading Aryans did not have Shiva as one of their gods. Instead they absorbed Shiva into their god Rudra.
Shiva is woshipped throughout Tamil Nadu. Thus, the so-called Dravidian Religion is nothing but worship of Shiva and his sons Ganesha and Murugan (Karthik).
It is clear that nobody imposed Hinduism on the Tamilians. Instead, the Dravidian Religion was made part of Hinduism and even spread among the invading Aryans as witness the temple to Shiva (Vishwanath) in Varanasi and other places.
There are other religions that were imposed on the Dravidians by offers of monetary benefits or by force; e.g., Christianity and Islam. But nobody talks about Christianity or Islam being religions alien to the Dravidians.
Why not?
Te real trouble with Tamilians is that they have a serious inferiority complex. This was fed by Periyar, Annadorai and their followers and still continues under Karunanidhi. That is why you get posts from Tamilians about "Dravidian Religion". These guys don't have a clue about Indian history.
RE:Dravidian Religion
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 08:57 PM Permalink
"The invading Aryans did not have Shiva as one of their gods. Instead they absorbed Shiva into their god Rudra. " - Oh yeah? Did you know that Shiva is itself a Sanskrit word? Shiva is Popular in tamil Nadu because he married Meenakshi the doughter of Pandian King and became a Pandian King himself. Also Karthikeya(Muruga) married a Tamil woman (Valli). But you guys need to no that Pandian kings are Decendants of Manu himself who helped vishnu in his Matsya Avatar.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manu_(Hinduism)
Therefore it is wrong to say that Shiva is southern god and Vishnu is from north.
Re: RE:Dravidian Religion
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:27 PM Permalink
Siva is non-other than Adi bhagwan . Adi bhagwan is first thirthankar of dravidian religion. This religon is later known as jainism and today it is followed mostly by converted aryans. aborginal followers of jainism have been converted to dalits during bhakti movement, this is historical and proven fact vouched by most of non-brahmins historians across the globe, however missing from indian text books.
RE:Dravidian Religion
by Pradip Parekh on Aug 04, 2008 10:16 PM Permalink
dear vignesh ji, i am sure millions of hindus appreciate your posts. recently i was at a conference of india-experts in dallas. speaker after speaker provided lengthy wonderful proofs that clearly debunked the so-called aryan invasion theory. i agree that ait was a political cookup in support of britain's pre-conceived political need to legitimize their bloodsucking rule over a totally subjugated, totally robbed, very poor, very tired and very vulnerable hindus of those days. it is not different from the hindus of today in the same state of vulnerability who fall victim to the exploitative missionary machhars. it is a good thing that more and more indians are shedding this programmed mindset that heretofore lapped up anything coming out of western world without due critical examination. so, i drink a tall glass of lassi to your post. thank you.
RE:Dravidian Religion
by tamil boy on Aug 05, 2008 12:31 AM Permalink
Tamils - have an inferiority complex? Wow thanks- everywhere I go, I am told Tamils have a superiority complex!!!!! Mate- Dravidian - in context - does not mean a race or an ethnic people - it means Tamil politics. In the Past - dravidian also included more than just Tamils - e.g. like in ancient Rome - the empire was called the Roman empire - and then it disintegrated and languages evolved from old Roman langauge. Similarly - Dravidian or old Tamil was an old culture and language - which evolved into different derivative of old Tamil. Modern Tamil is one of these derivative, and is called Tamil because it is closest to this old langauge.
I think you are confusing local politics, what Dravidian actually means, and Tamil or Southy Indian history. South India History is not really well known outside TN and the West, the west because of the colonial past, trades with ancient Egypt, ancient Greece, Ancient Rome etc....
RE:Dravidian Religion
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 08:34 PM Permalink
For your info, no one in Tamil Nadu gives a damn about Aryan Dravidian etc. They are all pious Hindus. Dont take DK guys seriously. But I am amazed at these DK guys's ability to bring up North South hatred in a jiffy. They are no different from any other seperatist organization. And again I am saying that Aryan invasion theory is a figment of British Historian's Imagination to divide and Convert India.
RE:Dravidian Religion
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 09:42 PM Permalink
No one wants DMK or ADMK in tamilnadu. But there is no effective alternative to them!Both the national parties dont have base in TN. thats why ppl vote to one of these parties.
PS : Aryan actually means noble kind. Jaya is no way an Aryan.
RE:Dravidian Religion
by Devavrata Satya on Aug 04, 2008 09:51 PM Permalink
We can hope that BJP manages to establish a base there soon, like they've done in Karnataka. Now I am no big fan of the BJP. I think it is just another party out to grab power by any means possible. But I think it is better than these other parties.
Just a small correction - Arya means noble. Some British genuises mistook Arya for Aryan, and so conjured up this Aryan invasion theory, which was happily lapped up by EVR and his cronies to serve their own ends.
Re: Dravidian Religion
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:24 PM Permalink
DRavidians followed sraminic systems and aryans followed brahminic ( vedic system).... Dravidians were never hindus. They way most of red-indians are converted to christianity, similarly dravidians were converted to dalitism during bhakti movement when 10000s of dravidians were mass murdered and their temples were converted. This is historical fact however missing from Indian brahminic history.
Dravidians were originally sramanic. even in indus valley non of vedic god's evidence was found. it was adi bhagwan of sramanic system. Same system was later known as jainism after 24th thirthankar when vedic torture ruined our social fabric. Infact non of vedic system has god worship system, except nature forces. These facts have been proven by most of non-brahminic scholars in India as well as all over world. But in india these historical facts will not show up. Couple of dravidian historians were murdered mysterically for bringing out these facts.
RE:Dravidian Religion
by Virgo on Aug 05, 2008 03:32 AM Permalink
There was no Aryan ivasion. It was the creation of the bigoted british historians. These bigot did not want to believe that the highly sophisticated Hindu vedic philosophy could not have been the creation of the 'lowly' natives. Hence they came up with the theory that Aryans from souther europe invaded India with and converted the natives to the vedic philosophy.
The fact is that Indian vedic philosophy originated in India and embraced and accomodated native ideas. There never was any clear division of Dravidian and Aryan BS before the British.
If you look at the Sinhalese peopple, they resemble the people of southern India more closely. However, their language and culture is highly sanscritised. You can see that in their names even. SL is a good proof that there never was a distinct and separate Dravidian or Aryan culture or religions. Just that some regional practices were different.
You will see the same trend in Karnataka, Kerala and Andhrapredesh.
Re: RE:Dravidian Religion
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:30 PM Permalink
Moderator is brahmin, so he does approve this theory, where as aboriginal dravidians are mass murdered or converted during bhakti movement. dravidians were never hindus. it was adi bhagwan dravidian god who was named in sankrit as Siva.
Do some research to reach dravidian history which is mutilated by crafty brahmins.
vigneshji, mythology or imaginary stories cannot prove the historical facts.
The time has come for us Indians to change our perception of cast, creed,north, south etc. We all are destined to live together as Indians. We have MORE than enough threat from not only our neighbours but also from far away places too. When neighbours try to stop our progress thrugh terror activities others from far and wide try to destroy us economically and culturally. So it is important for us to stand together as INDIANS (not as aryans or dravidians)for a better tomorrow for all of us Indians.
I am a tamilian and not a brahmin. There is no Dravidian religion here. People here are one of the most religious and cultured in India. The whole concept of dravidian civilization is a farce spread by DK and DMK. So I plead guys from other states not to judge us by the posts of these DK agents.
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Devavrata Satya on Aug 04, 2008 07:05 PM Permalink
But Mr. vig! What about our great rationalist Mr. Agnostic whose ancestors followed Dravdian religion, and who the evil Brahmins forced to convert to Hinduism! Surely rationalists cannot be liars peddling nonsense fantasies! I think you are a Brahmin who is up to his usual tricks of lying, since you are a foreigner in Tamil Nadu and hate the black Dravidians! Remember how Ram the white Aryan humiliated Ravana the black Dravidian - never mind that Ram was said to be dark-skinned and Ravana was a Brahmin well-versed in all scriptures! Mr. Agnostic and Mr. Periyar know it all better! They are rationalists, after all!
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 07:40 PM Permalink
Is that Sarcasm? Aryan Invasion Theory is a conspiracy by the British to divide and convert us. As B R Ambedkar says "That the theory of the Aryan race set up by Western writers fails to the ground at every point goes without saying….Anyone who comes to scrutinize the theory will find that it suffers from a ‘double infection.’ He could clearly see the implications of such ill-founded hypotheses which colonial Indology imposed on India and which Indian scholars went on repeating ad nauseam" Dravidam is reference to a geographical location like Anga, Vanga etc., rather than a race. And as you said, Ravana is in fact a Brahmin..
Let me tell u, Periyar and his bhakts are well versed in distorting facts. I once read in a stupid DK daily abt a Tamil verse sung by 'Appar', a saivaite saint in which he wishes to rape jain(Samana) women. Shocked by this, i referred to the original text. I found out that they changed words of the poem to make it mean that way!
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Die Hard on Aug 04, 2008 07:37 PM Permalink
Go and read the book "History of Tamils" by Srinivasa IYENGAR. If possible read புறநானூறு completely and understand what were the religious beliefs of ancient tamils
RE:RE:Tamils are Hindus
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 07:46 PM Permalink
புறநானூறு is not your own property.. Its the property of all the tamils. Bring on your knowledge of the ancient text and prove your words. By the way I can refer you many many books by Foriegn historians who condemn Aryan Invasion theory as a Drama staged by Missionaries. But the shameful fact is that Indian Historians accepted it faster than European and american counterparts.
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Viswa Nath on Aug 04, 2008 07:40 PM Permalink
the facts about India is not published here. Actually India belong to Dravidians. the aryans the encroachers of Iran and Iraq forced the Dravidiana to south India and they reproduced like animals to make India the second largest populated country in the world. Go through the history, in India all the prominant persons and scientists from time immemmorial are from the south India. India would have been more developed than America and Europe if this aryans the kin and kith of Ahmedi Najad and Saddam Hussain were sent bach to Iran and Iraq..
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Devavrata Satya on Aug 04, 2008 07:58 PM Permalink
I did not know that Rana Pratap and Prithviraj Chauhan were from South India.
I also did not know the JC Bose, Jayant Narlikar, Vikram Sarabhai, Homi Bhabha, Bhatnagar etc. were/are from South India.
Since you claim some " facts ", can you provide evidence for them?
How about bigoted South Indians like you are sent back to Egypt from where you came into India? But rest assured - unlike you, my heart and mind have not been corrupted by hateful nonsense passing for " facts ".
RE:RE:Tamils are Hindus
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 08:01 PM Permalink
Brother, He is just a product of Macaulay education. Dont develop regional Hatred. We are all Indians and we belong to this nation for ages.
RE:RE:Tamils are Hindus
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 07:59 PM Permalink
A typical student of History. Brother, the DNA evidences show that all europeans and persians were migrated from South Asia. Ahmedi Najad and Saddam Hussain are originally from here only. your views were that held in 1850s. The only country still persisting with Aryan Invasion Theory is India..
RE:RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Devavrata Satya on Aug 04, 2008 08:07 PM Permalink
Read Grimm Brothers. It clearly says that there are fairies and witches. Therefore these creatures must exist.
RE:RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Rupakshi on Aug 04, 2008 10:33 PM Permalink
"by Viswa Nath on Aug 04, 2008 08:04 PM Yes Aryans are the invaders of India. Read the history books.." Mr. ViswaNath, you may be a scholar in something, one cannot be scholar in everything. It is more than unlikely that some race called Aryan came. May be there was some Tamil religious beliefs which were modified by others-migrations take place all the time and influence local ideas and ideals. Some guys came and suppressed you sounds illogical. If they are that bad, why did they retain your individuality and language any way. I do not believe you know anything. Better read some of the Hindu scriptures, rather than distorted histories written by Roberts and Mullers.
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by vignesh vig on Aug 04, 2008 08:26 PM Permalink
All I am saying is that you should go through the scores of western History books which tell you Aryan Invasion Theory is False along with the DNA evidences and make up your mind on what to believe. You need to hear both the arguments before Judging
PS : I too believed in it after reading my 10th std History book.
Re: Tamils are Hindus
by Mr Pundit on Sep 19, 2008 12:34 PM Permalink
Tamils were never hindus. this is proven fact. They were however converted to brahminic religion during bhakti movement, i would say they were forced to accept dalitism, those who did not convert were mass murdered. Madurai history is witness to these archaelogical facts. Search 56 madurai caves, you will find it was all about dravidian aboriginal religion which is known as Samanar religion (sraminic system) later renamed as Jainism. Unfotunately today jainism is only followed by few converted aryans in few parts of india. where as aborginal jains are hardly few thousand in tamilnadu, maharastra, karnataka and kerala who are mostly known as Nainars.
RE:Tamils are Hindus
by Rupakshi on Aug 04, 2008 10:24 PM Permalink
The Dravidian Aryan was brought about by Max Muller. He himself later regretted and wanted to take out the theory and could not. That served the purpose of dividing India enough for popularizing Christianity, the main purpose of purring forward the theory any way. The antibrahminism is also a powerful tool to weaken Hindus. Brahmins were not just problem for Christian preachings, but a constant problem for British rule in India. The Brahmins who the majority in India were the target of Muslim rulers for the same reason. The crowing achievement of the British is to make them the target of Hindus themselves. I saw a Telugu Movie, Annamacharya, where the producer shows Brahmins burning the saitn's books. Any Brahmin burning a book never occurred in 10k history of India. Without their contributions to India, there is not much of Hindu civilization. Surprisingly, there no God who is portrayed as Brahmin. In-fact all demons including Ravana were Brahmins. These writings and depictions were preserved in various ways by Brahmins. Neither Ramayana or Mahabharata were written by Brahmins, yet Brahmins revered them. The antibrahnin DK movement amazes me. Without them, these guys would have been just tribes, let alone ministers and Governors.
