Another Viceroy, Lord Dufferin (1884-88), was advised by the Secretary of State in London that the 'division of religious feelings is greatly to our advantage', and that he expected 'some good as a result of your committee of inquiry on Indian education and on teaching material'.
'We have maintained our power in India by playing-off one part against the other,' the Secretary of State for India reminded yet another Viceroy, Lord Elgin (1862-63), 'and we must continue to do so. Do all you can, therefore, to prevent all having a common feeling.'
In his famous Khuda Bakhsh Annual Lecture (1985) Dr Pande said: 'Thus under a definite policy the Indian history books text-books were so falsified and distorted as to give an impression that the medieval [i.e. Muslim] period of Indian history was full of atrocities committed by Muslim rulers on their Hindu subjects and the Hindus had to suffer terrible indignities under Muslim rule. And there were no common factors [between Hindus and Muslims] in social, political and economic life.'
Therefore, Dr Pande was extra careful. Whenever he came across a 'fact' that looked odd to him, he would try to check and verify rather than adopt it uncritically.
RE:THE GREAT EMPEROR - SHAHENSHAH AURANGZEB
by JATIN HALDANKAR on Mar 21, 2007 07:03 PM Permalink
mike ...you have already posted this one week back ..all of your messages are wonderfully answered then ...why are you spaming the board with same message?? no matter how much you
shout with your lies they wont be considered as truth...
RE:RE:THE GREAT EMPEROR - SHAHENSHAH AURANGZEB
by Mike Gandhi on Mar 22, 2007 06:51 PM Permalink
You people are lost intelligence case. I know you forget the last week message. So I am refreshing you again the true history of Great Emperor Aurangzeb
His history claimed Hindus were slain for disputing with 'Muhammedans', generally prohibited from worshipping and taking out religious processions, their idols were mutilated, their temples destroyed, they were forced into conversions and marriages, and were killed and massacred by drunk Muslim tyrants. Thus Sir Henry, and scores of other Empire scholars, went on to produce a synthetic Hindu versus Muslim history of India, and their lies became history.
However, the noted Indian scholar and historian, Dr Bishambhar Nath Pande, who passed away in New Delhi on 1 June, ranked among the very few Indians and fewer still Hindu historians who tried to be a little careful when dealing with such history. He knew that this history was 'originally compiled by European writers' whose main objective was to produce a history that would serve their policy of divide and rule.
Lord Curzon (Governor General of India 1895-99 and Viceroy 1899-1904, d.1925) was told by the Secretary of State for India, George Francis Hamilton, that they 'should so plan the educational text books that the differences between community and community are further strengthened'.
RE:THE GREAT EMPEROR - SHAHENSHAH AURANGZEB
by Kamalprabha on Mar 21, 2007 04:26 PM Permalink
In these matters one should be extremely careful since we have had enough of "secular" historians like Romila Thapar who were given full freedom to write by our Socialst Nehru! Perhaps Dr Pande was one amoung them.Ohterwise it is well known about Aurangzeb and his atrocities! Remember the beheading of Sikh Guru?
The noted Indian scholar and historian, Dr Bishambhar Nath Pande, ranked among the very few Indians and fewer still Hindu historians who tried to be little careful when dealing with the Muslim rule in India that lasted for almost 1000 years.
Dr Pande passed away on 1 June 1998 and Impact International of London (July 1998) wrote the following obituary [at the end of the article], which we think sheds some light into some of the myths on Indian history, such as on Mughal Emperor Aurangzeb, created by the British with the clear objective of divide and rule:
The Muslim rule in India lasted for almost 1000 years. How come then, asked the British historian Sir Henry Elliot, that Hindus 'had not left any account which could enable us to gauge the traumatic impact the Muslim conquest and rule had on them'? Since there was none, Elliot went on to produce his own eight-volume History of India from its own historians (1867).
RE:THE GREAT EMPEROR - SHAHENSHAH AURANGZEB
by manivasan nil on Mar 21, 2007 04:53 PM Permalink
There are two reasons why no such detailed accounts were available in hindu writings.First,any writing is possible only if there is peace and stability in the country.Obviously, with the muslim domination on India(except the Vijayanagara period in south),you cannot expect the Hindus to sit and write their sufferings in details.
Secondly,most of the writings were by the high caste people who were patronised by the kings and it was a mutually beneficial(parasitic)relationship.Moreover,for vast sections of common men, it was immaterial whether the ruler is a Hindu or Muslim. His conditions remained same.
RE:RE:THE GREAT EMPEROR - SHAHENSHAH AURANGZEB
by wada pav on Mar 21, 2007 06:15 PM Permalink
These records have been left behind by muslim historians in books like 'badshahnama' and 'farmans' , and not by hindu historians.
besides not entire country was ruled by aurangzeb. parts of the country like maharashtra were ruled by Shivaji, in such parts there was stability and people could write history.
Wada pav I have no shame to quote from western, eastern, southern or northern Scholars who are qualified, Educated and with good conscience and Common Sense. Yesterday one comment came for Francois Gautier (Intellectual Prostitute). Do reasonable, rational, do justice, be sincere for your work. This should be the attitude of a normal person. You dont know I had been through 100 of sites which contain anti-Hinduism Material I can paste here. But when I talk to my Hindu friends about Hinduism they do not have knowledge about Hinduism and they accepted they never reads books and there is no basic education books for Hinduism. we learn few stories. We do not know how to eat and how to sleep, how to meet friends, how to perfor bath, how to deal about day to day life. We just learn from the traditions, customs, rituals, no basic guidance. Where as in Islam deals with day to day living. How to eat, sleep, bath, meet friends, respect of parents, respect or neighbours, how to make business you can find basic teaching all department of life.
I am not boosting that I am Muslim. I believ that You people are Muslims I cry for you. We Muslims but we feel shame that we are not up to mark. We are not practicing Fully we are weak.
RE:I have no shame to quote from Western Writers, Intellectuals, thinkers, Who are qualified, Educated, with Good Conscience and Common Sense.
by JATIN HALDANKAR on Mar 21, 2007 03:27 PM Permalink
islam cover each aspect of ones life ... to such extent even private aspect of life are covered ,,, Why do u need brain for ? if everything is written in book ...I belive that is the biggest drawback of islam .. it try to control human behaviour at micro level in the context of mediveal arabia ..
RE:This is from Sabeel Ahmed - In the light prophet biograpy, Hadith and scientific study
by JATIN HALDANKAR on Mar 21, 2007 03:11 PM Permalink
well ..rafiuddin ..one more article from islamic apologist ...here why didnt he choose to make disciple or better.. adopt her as daughter... why make such young girl who could possibly be your grand doughter...any answer ??
why do prophet of god has to be involved in wordly pleasures like ordinary human ....??
RE:You Asked for it? Wada Pav - Read this article based facts -
by JATIN HALDANKAR on Mar 21, 2007 03:15 PM Permalink
well ..rafiuddin ..one more article from islamic apologist ...here why didnt he choose to make disciple or better.. adopt her as daughter or sisters... why make such young girl 'Alisha' wife .. who could possibly be his grand doughter...any answer ??
why do prophet of god has to be involved in
wordly pleasures like ordinary human ....??
To protect other women do you have to marry them ..strange ..if he was so keen to make relation then why not sisters or daughter ??
RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by An Indian on Mar 21, 2007 04:11 PM Permalink
I have posted many messages and I claim I am not Brahmin, neither by birth nor by practice. I am with cosmopolitan background; enjoy friendly relationship with people from diverse background, religion; from Muslim, to Hindu, to Sikh, to Christian etc. etc. have widely travelled across the country and tried the find the reason behind such hatred, fundamentalism, fanaticism, denial of one%u2019s background / ancestors etc. etc. and whoever were logical they agree the truth, but those did not have the courage, tried to hushed-up the matter, but failed to reply rationally and logically. The biggest religion for the mankind is humanism and that is based on the truth. It is a universal truth that Sun raises in the East and it would be, I or anybody else in the earth does not have power to change or reverse it, so all the logical people would accept it and rest would try to hush-up the matter on the pretext of some or other. I have raised many burning topics through my earlier messages, which are affecting the life of majority (not on the basis of religion, rather basis of views / opinion), but so far no reader has replied.
For example, I often asked from my friends (including Muslims, qualified if not educated, but not that sort of hard core fundamentalists) that:
Why there should a separate personal law in the land (or in other word, why the people want to separate themselves from other, why they want to create differences when Islam teaches equality etc. etc. though the reasons may be many, responsible may be some unscrupulous political and religious leaders, but who is ultimately suffering, getting exploited, object of dissidences etc.)
Why there should be Haz subsidies, the waste of taxpayer%u2019s money (who has nothing to do with the Haz pilgrimage), and why to create again dissidences.
Why my Muslim brothers and sisters do not come forward to discard such exploitation and reduce the dissidences and bring the equality. Do they not feel that using the money of others though might have robbed legally, is not immoral and unethical.
In my personal life none of my Muslim friends had any answer. Here also our learned readers instead of correcting me, some has abused me, some tried to paste me the tag of Brahmin etc. etc. I am an Indian hard core patriot by heart and soul, and have deep pain when such fundamentalists tries to destabilize the social, psychological and economic life of Indian people. I can imagine the life in next 15 %u2013 20 years, as to what would happen if we are trying ignite the dissidence.
RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Secular Indian on Mar 21, 2007 01:59 PM Permalink
What are you rambling on about ? How do you know that the people who post here are exclusively Brahmins or upper caste ? Are you psychic ?
RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Mike Gandhi on Mar 21, 2007 03:07 PM Permalink
HEY SECULAR,
ARE YOU REALLY SECULAR ?? IF YES THEN OK. IF YOU HAVE ANY WIDOW OR DIVORCEE SISTER/S OR ANY RELATIVE ?? IF YES THEN DONT THROW THEM OUT OR TREAT THEM LIKE ANIMALS. ALSO DONT COMPEL THEM TO "SATI". WE ARE READY TO MARRY THEM. THEY CAN LIVE RESPECTFUL LIFE WITH DIGNITY, SECURITY AND FULL OF HAPPINESS.
RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Perv Sharma on Mar 22, 2007 08:32 AM Permalink
A muslim man raped his daughter in law and then the mullah as per Quran asked the man to marry his daughter in law in year 2005.
We hindus have come out of just blindly obeying the priests, but you muslims still following some 7th century A.D. barbaric laws of your Arab Masters.
RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by An Indian on Mar 21, 2007 04:15 PM Permalink
I atleast do not believe in arraning the marrige of a human with animal, becuase your language is seems to be of a lunatic.
RE:RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Ekalavyan on Mar 21, 2007 11:07 PM Permalink
You are the product of incest relations. So you are abarbarian
RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Perv Sharma on Mar 22, 2007 08:29 AM Permalink
Eka lavyan do ka You are running away from debate and abusing showing your true colour. No hard guess, u Arab Slave.
RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Secular Indian on Mar 21, 2007 05:37 PM Permalink
ROFL ... man you are truly pathetic ... your attempt at veiled abuse is rather crass .. I guess it goes with the your upbringing.
RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by JATIN HALDANKAR on Mar 21, 2007 03:21 PM Permalink
hey michael jackson ... Please come out of 16 centuary hindu india..hindus have came out of it ,... if possible even u come out of 7th centuary arabia...
RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Ekalavyan on Mar 21, 2007 02:54 PM Permalink
From the very nature of the messages, a kindergarten student of Indian society can understand the caste background of the writer. No advanced research is needed. WE belong to India. PLease bear in mind.Firstly ,have some social sense, history sense, time sense and finally some common sense and then participate in these debates. A simpleton like you may not digest these things.
RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by Secular Indian on Mar 21, 2007 05:39 PM Permalink
Not really, a person could find Islam to be a rather primitive religion/cult without being an Brahmin or for that matter belong to any religion. Try again!
RE:RE:RE:LOW QUALITY OF NET DEBATES = OVER DOMINANCE OF BRAHMIN ''CYBER COOLIES''?
by sameer on Mar 28, 2007 08:53 PM Permalink
Thiseklav is a cross between dog and human being.
What Great People said about the Prophet Muhammad PBUH?
Some of the famous, contemporary personalities who read the biography of the Messenger of Allaah, sallallaahu %u2018alayhi wa sallam, could not help but admit that he was a master with excellent manners and an honorable character, and the following are some of their sayings:
Michael Hart , author of %u2018The 100:
A Ranking of the Most Influential Persons in History%u2019 said: "My choice of Muhammad to lead the list of the world's most influential persons may surprise some readers and may be questioned by others, but he was the only man in history who was supremely successful on both the religious and secular level.%u201D
George Bernard Shaw, the British playwright said:
%u201CThe world is in dire need of a man with the mind of Muhammad; religious people in the Middle Ages, due to their ignorance and prejudice, had pictured him in a very dark way as they used to consider him the enemy of Christianity. But after looking into the story of this man I found it to be an amazing and a miraculous one, and I came to the conclusion that he was never an enemy of Christianity, and must be called instead the savior of humanity. In my opinion, if he was to be given control over the world today, he would solve our problems and secure the peace and happiness which the world is longing for.%u201D
Annie Besant, wrote in %u2018The Life and Teachings of Muhammad%u2019 :
%u201CIt is impossible for anyone who studies the personality of the great Prophet of the Arabs, and come to know how this prophet he used to live, and how he taught the people, but to feel respect towards this honorable prophet; one of the great messengers whom Allaah sent%u201D
Alphonse de La Martaine wrote in %u2018Historie de la Turquie%u2019:
"If greatness of purpose, smallness of means, and astonishing results are the three criteria of a human genius, who could dare compare any great man in history with Muhammad? The most famous men created arms, laws, and empires only. They founded, if anything at all, no more than material powers which often crumbled away before their eyes. This man moved not only armies, legislations, empires, peoples, dynasties, but millions of men in one-third of the then inhabited world; and more than that, he moved the altars, the gods, the religions, the ideas, the beliefs and the souls. Philosopher, Orator, Apostle, Legislator, Conqueror of Ideas, Restorer of Rational beliefs... The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire -- that is Muhammad. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he?%u201D
J.W.H. Stab wrote in %u2018Islam and its Founder %u2019 :
%u201C Judged by the smallness of the means at his disposal, and the extent and permanence of the work that h
RE:What Great People said about the Prophet Muhammad PBUH?
by wada pav on Mar 21, 2007 01:09 PM Permalink
YOU ARE SHAMELESSLY QUOTING WESTEN AUTHORS , WHY CAN'T YOU PROVIDE EVIDENCE FROM KORAN,HADITHS?
RE:RE:RE:What Great People said about the Prophet Muhammad PBUH?
by JATIN HALDANKAR on Mar 21, 2007 02:59 PM Permalink
Koran allows to marry many womans ...whihc eventually means having many children per person ..in the era when world is concerned about population explosion ..if such outdated practices are made rampant in name of religion then i belive that religion is also outdated...
secondly, are you claiming in muslim world woman staying unmarried turn whore ??
RE:RE:RE:RE:What Great People said about the Prophet Muhammad PBUH?
by mohammed ahmed on Mar 21, 2007 03:17 PM Permalink
they don't stay unmarried, in the first place, if they are childless or they are under 40.
RE:RE:What Great People said about the Prophet Muhammad PBUH?
by rafiuddin farooqui on Mar 21, 2007 02:26 PM Permalink
You speaks non-sense, you are quoting from the anti-muslim site which nothing to do with Quran and Hadith. I can not taught you here Quran or Hadith. You must go to Madarasa (Schools)( the RSS goons doesnt know in Urdu and Farsi Madarsa means school.) take lessons it is good for you and your generation. Shut your mouth reading RSS Gangs and Goons Literature or Anti-Muslims site of Jews and Hindus would not make you scholar of Islam. Go ba ba to any Madarsa. Get Knowledge. Not read and pasting here will make you scholar. Raja kuch kar le. Otherwise you are doing suicide.
