Always keep it in mind our politician's Mayavathi's, Nehru and Family, Yadav's, Singh's only are continuing the divide and rule of the British. There is no love lost for anyone except for the sake of vote banks. Muslims will vote in Mass for one candidate. Where as the upper & the middle class hindus are least bothered to vote and the poor only vote based on their alliances to the candidates. Hence the muslim are the prized catch and hence all these pamperisms are going on to them.
The moment the Hindus are united and let them one in masse to one Hindu party where all these things will would exist.
Hindus are divided bunch in the name of caste and subcastes, creed, region, language, culture etc as long as this divisive forces exist we can never be unified. And the politicians need this to garner votes for their greed of power.
Just for an example to know that the OBC's reservation is made o Database complied by the British in 1931. How far is it relevant now after 76 years terms of age, terms of the data collected, how it was manipulated by the British and by our politicians. Even to think its absurd and ridiculus. Just think Our youngsters lives are based on a database of the 1930's. How many laws are still there like this and which need Judicial Review. These age old laws need to be repealed.
As for the muslims they will enjoy and reap all the benefits of all the doles of secularism. 98 % of their allegiance is always for Pakistan. Once they become even a small majority then it shall a shria country. Please recall how many secular countries exist where they are a majority, There are none.
RE:Mockery
by rajesh bhaskar on Apr 01, 2007 08:16 PM Permalink
who is their for hindus man. bjp. recently 5 family members killed in kashmir. what happend, did bjp ministers so called advani or modi visited there. no . what we need to do. get the kashmiris AK.47 in their hand. if bjp and rss can't do that tell them don't bark for hinduism. kashmiri hindus need self protection and teach them if you have to kill you have to . that is what geetha taught, be patient like an earth buteven after somebody bothers you kill them. follow geetha our problem will be solved or atlest our sister will not die by rape . they can fight for their self and respectfully die in bullet
RE:Mockery
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 07:09 PM Permalink
Your claims of Muslims enjoying and reaping the benefits of secularism echoes a mentality that feeds on stereotypes fed by the Hindutva brigade. The Sachar Committee report conclusively proves where Muslims stand, despite years of what you so vehemently profess as "minority appeasement." If they have been appeased so well, show me the proof of their progress.
RE:Mockery
by Raju Puducode on Apr 01, 2007 11:42 PM Permalink
The increasing activity of Islamic Terrorists in interior parts of India and the ease with which arms are delivered and distributed in states like UP, Kerala, Karnataka, AP goes to highlight the safe havens that Islamic Terrorism now enjoys in India. An environment of Political Mobilization of Muslims on religious grounds has spawned competitive minorytism amongst the so called secular Parties like Congress & Communists and the State Governments where they are in power.
By condoning Muslim Fundamentalist violence during the Iran and Cartoon Issues and Pan Islamic Political Mobilization over these issues the Governments in UP and in New Delhi have contributed to the creation of an environment where it is ok to encourage, shelter and patronize those whose loyalties to a Global Islamic cause are stronger than their love & respect to the Laws of their Motherland. This when combined with the Muslim Criminal elements who have been given a free reign in Uttar Pradesh Governance of Mulayam Yadav creates Institutional safe havens where Islamic terrorism can germinate and flourish with no fear of consequences because there are many layers of Secular Cover that they can operate under.
All of the above will only receive further boost as these Muslim bodies organize themselves politically thus pushing the so-called secular parties to work overtime in wooing them with rabid minorytism. All of this has portends ominously to the future of internal security and safety of India.
RE:Mockery
by venugopal bhat on Apr 01, 2007 10:15 PM Permalink
Muslim backwardness is because muslims prefer madrassa education to modern education...so the responsibility lies not with the government but the mentality of the community and the mullahs
RE:Mockery
by Sameer on Apr 01, 2007 07:39 PM Permalink
Yes all those talking about Muslims appeasement are fools who have fallen in traps of politicians. This bloody policians have done nothing for the muslims other than provocating some of our hindu brothers who believe in these politicians.
RE:RE:Mockery
by yadav on Apr 01, 2007 08:22 PM Permalink
The point here all those suedo secular parties just appeased the muslims(like Shabano case) but never really worked for their progress.U guys are being fooled by them. They just make u fool by doing things which make u happy but never makes u progress.Ex:making rallies when saddam is hanged or about cartoons, imposing Shariot law in Kashmir(mind that we are secular country). Tell me one instance where they supported u in a progressive cause. These parties fund u in building shadikhanas and madarsas and huz subsidy. They just play with ur sentiments and communal feelings.Instead of that parties like BJP dont treat u guys as backward or special people. Ur given equal status in the society where in u can compete with all and progress.
RE:Mockery
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 08:30 PM Permalink
Well, the way Muslims are treated in BJP ruled states like Gujarat doesnt comfort the minorities in any manner. If Congress is bad, BJP is worse. Where is the question of equal status there.
RE:Mockery
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 07:06 PM Permalink
Mandal Commission which recommended 27 per cent job reservations, had based its findings on data provided by renowned sociologists like M.N. Srinivas and others. No survey has put the ratio of OBCs below 27 per cent. Check out your statistics before rushing to ridicule these figures.
RE:Mockery
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 07:03 PM Permalink
For your info, a nine-member Supreme Court Bench had allowed 27 per cent job reservation for OBC, recommended by the Mandal commission. THat was not in 1930. And those opposed to OBC reservations are the upper castes, who talk about Hindu unity only when it concerns a debate against Muslims. Stop being a hypocrite.
HINDUSTAN MEIN HINDU KAHA SAFE HAI? SAB LOG BAAT KAR RAHE HAI MUSLIMS, CHRISTIAN E.T.C LEKIN HINDU KAHA HAI, KAHA HAI HINDU, POLITICIANS HAMESHA MINORITY MINORITY BOLE KE VOTE BANK KE PEECHE BAAGTE REHATE HAI, BANGALADESH KE KITANE LOG INDIA MEIN HAI? KAM SE KAM 5 LACS, AUR PAKISTAN KE COUNT BHI NAHI KAR SAKATE, YEH SAB POLITICIANS KA KAMAAL HAI. PHIR BHI MERA BHARAT MAHAAN.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Sachin Tendulkar on Apr 01, 2007 07:25 PM Permalink
After sometime Hindustan will be renamed Muslimstan. Our politicians are capable of anything
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Ramakrishna Panicker on Apr 02, 2007 10:58 AM Permalink
Let us live here irrespective of Caste, creed and Religion. All are aware that none is responsible creating in India for religious enmity other than selfishness sheathed politicians, and their cunningness only lead them to proclaim unnecessary & useless promises day by day.
One day these politicians hinting on those poor children who are labouring for their livelihood saying that children are to be treated as gods and goddesses therefore children ought not to be permitted to labour. Other day is on poor farmers and their agricultural products. And next, day is on the bank loans of poor farmers and writes off of the same. In fact poor farmers are always away from bank loans and big Zamindars are always benefited from Banks and other financial agencies.
Whereas truth is like an open Kithab that when opportunity arises these honored personalities are not keeping faith to suck sweat and blood of the children and thereafter the body parts are also selling to earn money. For example, Noida, Attari brutal killings of the poor children are before us with undraped blood spots and their suffering parents hot tear drops. For these Noida killings, we feel that Mayawati has nothing to say for that down trodden parents of those ill fated children slaughtered, because those were the young ones of poor families. And, we know that other than micro phone announcements nothing left for the poor in our country. Now we see BSP Leader, in open, blames BJP is making communal agenda for Muslims stating that she never allowed Bharatiya Janata Party to enforce its "communal agenda" when it was supporting her government in Uttar Pradesh.
We have a request to the leaders who are in every movements behind with the idea to split the poor people and enjoy their life in whatsoever way not loosing even a drop of sweat live peacefully to let us live jointly forgetting caste, creed and religion with those products in reciprocation to our hard labour.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 07:30 PM Permalink
Huh, when you talk about minorities, "Hindus" become one entity. But when it comes to OBC reservations, Hindus are divided along caste lines. And the upper castes have big problems agaisnt their fellow "Hindus." Hypocrisy cant get more absurd than this. The anger at OBC reservations and reservations in general proves at least one thing: That a big share of the so-called "Hindus" are favoured, given special preference. THe hundreds of castes categorised under OBC, SC, ST, are not Muslim. Cant I then call this "Hindu appeasement?" I apply the same logic that you have professed in your message. In Hindu majority India, Hindu appeasement is fair enough. So, why complain?
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Pat Thakur on Apr 01, 2007 08:46 PM Permalink
Well dear, you talk eloquently about so many things my friend. But you have completetly forgotten one thing; the ones who demanded a seperate nation were Muslims & the ones who accepted the demand were Hindus. Even after getting a country of their own, still you believe the Muslims should continue demanding & expect to get each & every demand of theirs completed? Tell me, how much rights do Hindus enjoy in Pakistan or any Muslim country for that matter? Compared to that, I think, India is a heaven (JANNAT in your parlance) for Muslims, isn't it?
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 09:14 PM Permalink
Jinnah and the Muslim League pressed for Pakistan. But the Sangh Parivar was no holy cow either. Its chief mentor, V.D. Savarkar formulated the two-nation theory in his essay Hindutva, published in 1923, 16 years before Jinnah came up with it.
RE:RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Vipin Gupta on Apr 01, 2007 09:39 PM Permalink
tell me why muslims are asking for seperate Muslim Law , why muslims in India celebrate and distribute sweets when Pakistan wins, why every terrorist caught is Muslim,why always riots begins from muslim dominated areas. muslims are backward and are not progressing due to their own fanatic approach,they dont want to study as other Indians they want to learn how to make bombs and how to kill other people. their only motive is to convert this whole world into Muslim. But let me clear you this fact that you are the part of Hinduism the man how create muslim religion was a Hindu brahmin and later or sooner you all guys have to come back in your original religion.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 10:11 PM Permalink
Mr. Gupta, By responding to deeply prejudiced anti-Muslim views of the radical Hindus, I am in no way defending the demands of the radical Muslims. Many Muslims do exist in the dark ages, caught in ghettos in India, where the light of modern education has not reached. While I admit that and do hope that they come to the mainstream, I cant help but ridicule the half-truths and stereotypes dished out by the Sangh Parivar regularly to meet its deeply divisive ends.
RE:[object]
by kitttigadu on Apr 02, 2007 02:23 AM Permalink
Rasheed Mullah,
Savarkar also probably wrote that all Muslims should be transplanted to the other side of the border. Do you want that to happen too. Why implement only half of his scheme. Let us complete it.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Rasheed on Apr 02, 2007 10:57 AM Permalink
Go take a walk in your Shakha and come back with something more sensible, although I suspect whether you could anything from there. Before you spew venom against all Muslims and sundry, take a hard look at your half pant and wonder whether you deserve to be in a democratic, secular country like India. Perhaps a dip in the Ganges would do you a world of good.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Naresh Nayak on Apr 01, 2007 09:45 PM Permalink
Dear Vipin,
I am okay if the Muslims want to adopt the Shariat. What I am not okay is selective application of teh Shariat. If the Muslim men want the liberty to marry four women, they should also be ready to embrace the Shariat Criminal Code. Every muslim thief must have his limbs lopped off, every murderer should have his head lopped off. Only then will India be known as truly Secular. Selective application of Shariat Code is not at all acceptable.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by Rasheed on Apr 01, 2007 08:57 PM Permalink
Mr. Thakur, Islamic Pakistan is not a model for democratic India to emulate. And the Hindutva brigade can hardly take credit for the democratic nature of India, because their contribution to the freedom struggle was minimal at best. For your info, India is not a Hindu Rashtra, not as yet. So, please hold your horses before you lecture Indian Muslims on where they stand. THe Muslim League which was in the forefront of the demand for Pakistan did not represent all Muslims of undivided India. So, you cannot make the Indian Muslims guilty of creating Pakistan. And I repeat, India is a heaven for Muslims not because the Hindutva brigade chose to be it that way, but because of the greatness of Hindu civilisation and the modern outlook of majority Hindus. Dont rush to take credit for that. And just as an aside, take this: THe RSS gurus had first talked about the two-nation theory. Much before Jinnah did so.
RE:JOKE OF THE DECADE
by kitttigadu on Apr 02, 2007 02:18 AM Permalink
This is a typical Muslim strategy, divide themselves into subgroups when in error and shift the blame to the other subgroup. If majority of the muslims did not want Pakistan, then why did your grandfathers not confront the Muslim league and undercut it?? FYI, in the provincinal elections before independence, 95% of the Muslims voted for the Muslim league. You guys cannot eat your cake and have it too. We Hindus would have kept quiet if our community was treated well in Bangladesh and Pakistan. What is the reality, we have been exterminated in Pakistan and well on that road in Bangladesh and Kashmir too. So, the bottomline is that you muslims are living in our inheritance. So better keep that in mind before making unreasonable demands. You cannot keep your two-faced nature of Sharia where you are in a majority and democracy and 'minority rights' when you are in a minority.
RE:[object]
by Rasheed on Apr 02, 2007 11:04 AM Permalink
Huh, your division into subgroups to defend your tribe is legendary. THe latest outbursts by the meritorious upper castes on the OBC reservation issue is fitting proof of your doublespeak. United Hindus, what a joke. I never said the majority of Muslims did not want Pakistan pre-independence. Read my post again before you spell out your judgements. Anyways, your view could be deliberate considering the tendency to selectively read history by you and your ilk. I reiterate India is not yet your dream Hindu Rashtra and so, dont rush to avenge the "extermination" of your tribe in Pakistan and Bangladesh. Perhaps, you justify the fate of Muslims in Gujarat and consider that a just act of revenge. If that is the case, then it just shows how sick a mind can get. I am no defender of Sharia, so there's no point raising that to me. I do have my complaints against a lot of Muslim practices. So count me out. But that does not in any way dilute my stand against Hindu radicals of your kind.
RE:Muslims should not be misled
by VIJAYA BUDDHIRAJU on Apr 01, 2007 07:24 PM Permalink
Who ever can come up with enblock vote matter-others do not. India is only country in human history which has quotas for ever, that too for majority protection based on caste which they always complain about. May be Churchill was right when he said the Fakirs never deserved independence. The African countries proved it in one way-the Indians the other. They became a class of ungrateful people with antibramini scum on one side and rewarding treason on the other.
what have these so called secular parties like SP, BSP, Congress done for muslims? they have not done anything for their economic and social upliftment. even muslims are at fault. they consider madarsas more important than govt. schools. they are still in the 8th century beliefs and concept of jihad unlike catholics who were ignorant earlier but now are the most modern and progrssive people.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Tanweer on Apr 01, 2007 07:19 PM Permalink
I want to bring some facts in kind notice about madarsa education. Why muslims prefer to go madarsa. I think that you know a major population of muslims are below poverty line. Madarsas provide free education and this is the cause that most of the muslims get their education in madarsa.
RE:RE:[object MouseEvent]
by yadav on Apr 01, 2007 08:40 PM Permalink
FOR PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT RIOTS AND BJP. THER WERE RIOTS BEFORE 1980 WHEN THERE IS NO BJP. FOR AN EX. IN HYDERABAD CONGRESS DISSIDENT LEADERS STARTED RIOTS TO OUST THEIR CM. MUSLIMS DONT NEED PROTECTION FROM BJP, THEY NEED PROTECTION FROM THE FANATICS IN THEM SELVES AND SEUDO SECULAR PARTIES LIKE CONGRESS, COMMUNISTS. THEY NEED PROTECTION FROM PARTIES LIKE MUSLIM LEAUGE AND MAJLIS WHO GIVE THEM INSECURITY FEELING AND FROM TRAITORS LIKE BHUKARI WHO PROVOKE THEM.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Raju Puducode on Apr 01, 2007 11:37 PM Permalink
The increasing activity of Islamic Terrorists in interior parts of India and the ease with which arms are delivered and distributed in states like UP, Kerala, Karnataka, AP goes to highlight the safe havens that Islamic Terrorism now enjoys in India. An environment of Political Mobilization of Muslims on religious grounds has spawned competitive minorytism amongst the so called secular Parties like Congress & Communists and the State Governments where they are in power.
By condoning Muslim Fundamentalist violence during the Iran and Cartoon Issues and Pan Islamic Political Mobilization over these issues the Governments in UP and in New Delhi have contributed to the creation of an environment where it is ok to encourage, shelter and patronize those whose loyalties to a Global Islamic cause are stronger than their love & respect to the Laws of their Motherland. This when combined with the Muslim Criminal elements who have been given a free reign in Uttar Pradesh Governance of Mulayam Yadav creates Institutional safe havens where Islamic terrorism can germinate and flourish with no fear of consequences because there are many layers of Secular Cover that they can operate under.
All of the above will only receive further boost as these Muslim bodies organize themselves politically thus pushing the so-called secular parties to work overtime in wooing them with rabid minorytism. All of this has portends ominously to the future of internal security and safety of India.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 09:00 PM Permalink
btw yadav cud u plz tell this forum the agenda of RSS, VHP, Bajrang Dal and many more such parties and what has been their stand on muslims until now
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Vipin Gupta on Apr 01, 2007 09:49 PM Permalink
If people living in America are Americans, people from Britain are British then why Muslims living in hindustan are not Hindus? Muslims should feel proud of themselfs that we hindus have given them a respectful life over here and if they will not stop there anti nation activities then they should call up there relatives in other islamic countries to arrange a accomodation for them in near future. Whereever these guys are they are creating problems : USSR - Russia, UK , Thailand, malasia every where. WAKE UP MUSLIMS STOP ALL THIS.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 09:55 PM Permalink
hello vipin who r u to let muslims stay here theystay on their own u cant do a shit abt it its been a continuous process but what has happened u have become more insecured abt urselves i wonder who wud accpet u when we start throwing u out of india, njoy n think u dickhead btw arabian sea wont be a bad idea for all of u
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by khan on Apr 01, 2007 10:00 AM Permalink
Mr Samir its very true that these so called secular party have not done any thing for the muslim upliftment.BUT STILL THE MUSLIM WILL VOTE FOR THEM BECOUSE THEY PROVIDE SECURITY TO THEM,THEY PREVENT COMMUNAL RIOTS, AND ITS VERY TRUE THAT WEN EVER THE BJP OR ITS ALLIES RULED THERE HAD A MOJOR RIOTS AND MUSLIM HAD TO SUFFER BADLY.THEY HAVE TO LOOSE LIFE,DIGNITY,BREAD AND BUTTER, WE KNOW IT VERY WELL THAT THESE PARTIES AR INCOMPETENT,CORRUPT,BAND OF CRIMINALS,THERE EXISTENCE IN POWER IS A HINDRENCE IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT OF THE STATE,BUT STILL WE VOTE BECOZE WE KNOW THAT IF THEY ARE IN POWER AT LEAST OUR MOTHER AND SISTERS WILL NOT RAPED,OUR HOUSES WILL NOT BE BURNED,WE WILL NOT BE DEPRIVED OF BREAD AND BUTTER,
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Samir Ankalikar on Apr 01, 2007 11:59 AM Permalink
hello mr khan, u said that these so called secular parties will protect u from BJP. then tell me why didnt a single congress or SP worker come to the rescue of muslims during the 2002 gujrat riots???
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Shivraj Menon on Apr 01, 2007 01:00 PM Permalink
hello mr khan, I REPEAT WHAT SAMIR HAS ASKED YOU..... "u said that these so called secular parties will protect u from BJP. then tell me why didnt a single congress or SP worker come to the rescue of muslims during the 2002 gujrat riots???"
Khan Sb,... I have frens of all religious beliefs... I feel that is their personal choice for some disciplined ways in life. I treat is the same way we have different personal ways of food habits, reading habits, health habits, toiletry habits, sexual habits etc. So the frendship does not interfere in each others personal habits.. and may it be left with the individuals... We join together for our professional likes, hobbies, social ervices etc.. and that shud be there... If we shed that one group favours one religion n hates other religion we will remain underdeveloped personally... Many riots have happened.. but u see those selfish leaders .. they do not bother.... The way today WE ireespective of caste and class have strongly condemned the CRICKET PLAYERS attitude and the BCCI's ways.. we should now come out against immatured, ill mannered, narrowminded decision makers and should enlightene the misled ordinary junta... AMEN
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by khan on Apr 01, 2007 01:41 PM Permalink
Tell me dear as per gujrat riots ,Mr Modi justified it saying"action is having recation" but tell why there was no reaction after akshardham incedent,doesnt it mean that the first reaction was state sponsered.if the modi led government was able to stop the second reaction y he failed to stop the first reaction. and during the gujrat riot muslim wer so shocked that they hardly got breath to protest,and the major protest wer from this so called secular parties,all hindus intellectuals (secular)wer protesting against the riots. and how come these SP and BSP or RJD could stop these riots wen they them self are targets. i dont mean to justify thing,the basic is how u project ur self,these so called secular parties have projected them self as a protector then muslim are taking them as protector,BJP projected them self as the assian of muslim then the muslim have taken them as assasian. And one more thing i'd like to say muslims can be anti BJP or its like minded ppl,but they are never anti india,or anti indian,they will never allow to harm their homeland,its not possible at all
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Manjunath on Apr 01, 2007 03:55 PM Permalink
Dear Khan, Remember one thing if you are against BJP then you are anti Indian. BJP will project Muslims like this in India this is the truth.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Sameer on Apr 01, 2007 07:16 PM Permalink
Dear Manjunath, If you are against secular party then you are anti-Indian. Secular party will protect your whole family my dear.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by chinmoy chatterjee on Apr 01, 2007 12:56 PM Permalink
Dear Khan, It will be better if Muslims forgets that they are muslims then automatically Hindus will forget that they are Hindus,-actually this kind of thinking is a brainwash by the politicians,-pl come out of it.When Muslims will start thinking " first we r Indians and we believe same rights for every citizen , u will see the problem is solved and these cruel politiciaqns will escape from this country,-so pl make it and convince yr freinds in this way.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Asrar Mohammed on Apr 01, 2007 04:12 PM Permalink
Dear Chatterjee, Muslims in no part of the world will forget that they are muslims, its their belief and so they cant and we follow/should follow the principles set up 1400 years back. But being a muslim doesnt mean that they are anti-Non-muslims and neither it teaches us to hate others for no cause. We do love our mother land as much as others do, bcz thats the place we are born and grown up. It is this reason that makes our eyes wet whenever some of us return to India after a long time. But what had happened in Gujrat makes every muslim in India and all around the world to hate other beliefs. I personally doesn't support any political party as I understand that they all are same, they are selfish and are not friends to anyone. Hindus and Muslims will fight as long as these politicians are there to govern our country, they will make their every attempt to exploit our relations as britishers did. The only way, is to unite and fight against these corrupt & selfish politicans and the educated youth have to involve in the political areas and make this country the best place to live in the world and I do think that people now in India are understanding this fact.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by HansRaj Sharma on Apr 01, 2007 04:49 PM Permalink
Many years ago once India beaten Pakistan in a cricket match and on that occasion I saw reaction of a local muslim guy who told to me that blood came in his eyes when India beaten Pakistan. This is not an exception. Many of my friends have shared such experiences... This is the reason I feel PAKISTANI MUSLIMS ARE MUCH MUCH BETTER CITIZENS THAN INDIAN MUSLIMS. AT LEAST THEY ARE NOT NAMAK HARAM LIKE INDIAN MUSLIMS.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 05:11 PM Permalink
hansraj u have stooped so low that no muslim wud go to match ur lowliness, i m sorry this one cant attract any backfire
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by An Indian on Apr 01, 2007 05:18 PM Permalink
I SECOND TO WHAT HANSRAJ SAYS. I have seen this happening always, especially when ever India plays Pakistan. I used to face taunts from muslim guys on streets if and when India won a match against pakistan....as if I was responsible for that and as if Indian muslims are basically Pakistanis. Came on pals, we all know Indian muslims some where in their heart show loyalty to Pakistan...because they believe Islam is Pakistan and viceversa.
And to all those friends who are advising to readHoly Koran...my all respects are for that book..but doesn't it explicitely say that "ALL NON MUSLIMS ARE KAAFIRS...AND ALL MUSLIMS SHOULD EITHER GET THEM TO ISLAMIC FOLD OR KILL THEM" !! Do you want me to mention the aayat where this is mentioned?
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by play on Apr 01, 2007 05:27 PM Permalink
Dear My Friend Indian,
I understand your anger an resentment. Tell me what is the MEaning of Kafir? before knowing what it means please try to find out or do a reaserach. Kafir in Arabic means those who do not practice or believe in Islam. It litreally means for Non-Muslims. Non- Muslims is nothing but Kaafir.This word is highly and most famously mis - understood by non mulsims.
See brother there is no compulsion in religion. Before making any comment or vierd attacking Islam please try to read its meaning and understand its message first. Quran very clearly states that there is no compulsion in religion. If you want to accept the truth accept it. If not dont accept it. Very simple as that. No muslim ever says force a non muslim that he should become muslim. First look at the scriptures, know the truth for yourself than u Judge.
For your Information brother, Quran is not meant only for Muslims. But also for non-muslims or for the whole of humanity. It is sent down as a mercy for mankind. So this is another mis conception among non-muslims that Quran is only for muslims.
The ayaat which you have mentioned is wrongly understood by. See in order understand the Quran you should read the whole Quran and not parts and peices here and there. If you read it like that you will get mis understand the whole Meaning.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 05:25 PM Permalink
get rid of ur inner feeling that muslims favor pak and India wud be a better place n u wont feel so insecured of muslims and islam
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Asrar Mohammed on Apr 01, 2007 05:46 PM Permalink
Mr Indian, Here's an Indian-Muslim replying u. Islam doesn't mean Pakistan, Islam is a belief as Hinduism is. Hinduism doesnt mean India, if it is so then why there are Indians in UAE, SAUDI ARABIA and all other Muslim nations. So, religion is a belief and not bound to a country or part of earth. As a Indian Muslim, I am loyal to my Religion and my country. So even living side by side with Pakistanis abroad, we are lill apart from them as they dont share the thinking as an Indian does. So come out your illusions and have a broader thinking, we are the ones to change this nation and to remove these differenes, talk, discuss and come to a common platform. I am against all those people who killed Muslims in Gujrat but by the way as a Muslim, I am also against those Muslims who killed INNOCENT Hindus. Thanks for giving your respect for our holy book. Now to ur comment: "ALL NON MUSLIMS ARE KAAFIRS". Yes all non-Mulims are Kaafirs, because the meaning of Kaafir is "Non-Muslim". Same as if u call a Muslim as "Non-Hindu" doesnt mean anything different, because he is a Non-Hindu. So understand the basics and dont come to a conclusion so soon. Your comment: "AND ALL MUSLIMS SHOULD EITHER GET THEM TO ISLAMIC FOLD OR KILL THEM". Good research, bro !! No you dont need to specify the aayat where it is written. But if you have read that sentence, then read the whole context before and after the aayat and then come to a conclusion. You have read a sentence without its context. THIS AAYAT DOESNT MEAN THAT ALL MUSLIMS ALL AROUND THE WORLD SHOULD KILL ALL NON-MUSLIMS. Similar way if the consitution of India, depicts somewhere in its rules: Hang the person...... U cant say that Indian consitution orders all people to be hanged. It says that as a punishment, for a SPECIAL CAUSE/CASE and doesnt apply for all and at all times. So Understand Muslims in general, There are good and bad Muslims in all part of the world. Doings of some doesnt mean that all are to be blamed as I dont blame all Hindus for killing some Muslims. So come to a common platform amd remove your differences and Understand Muslims who constitutes to the 2nd largest believers in the world and make India the best place to live and eradicate all evils from our Home land.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by An Indian on Apr 01, 2007 05:58 PM Permalink
My Dear Friend 'Play' & Asrar,
First of all, God bless you !
I have all respects for all religions of this world, but i now find that religion, which was supposed to bring whole mankind on the right path - has infact splitted and ghettoised the world
I've some questions in response to ur mail:
1/ If ur first para says that all non muslims are kaafirs. So aren't Hindus kaafirs then ? And doesn't Holy Quran advise to kill kaafirs?
2/ The foundation of Holy Quran is on "La Illah ha Illalah - Mohamaada (pbuh) Rasuulaallah". Which means that there is no God except Allah, and Hazrat Mohammad ( sallaau ale wassalam) is his only prophet. If yes, then how come Islam is so open, free and liberal to non muslims to advise them to continue with their faith ?
3/ Doesn't Islam advocate imposition of Jaaziya on non muslims ? Friends who dont know Jaaziya - Its a tax which was imposed on only Hindus in Bharat during mughal period. This is allowed in Islam. Hindus were allowed to practise their faith during Mughal period by paying extra tax, or face Aurangzeb, Taimur Lung, Babar, Shahjehan etc sword. Sri Guru Tej Bahadur was killed by Aurangzeb (the most bloodiest of them all) at Chandni Chowk - Delhi, because he opposed this.
4/ I've many Kashmiri Pandit friends - who were thrown out by their Muslim brothers - because Muslims are in majority in Kashmir. They were told to convert to Islam or leave valley. "Kashmir mei jisko rehna hoga - Allah ho akbar kehna hoga" was a very common slogan in those days. Why ?? Couldn't they co-exist ?? Where did teachings of holy Koran go at that time, which according to you, advocates tolerance for other religions ??
5/ And my dear friend, turn the pages of Indian history, almost all muslims were convereted by invaders from Persia / Afganistan (Ghazni etc) / Iraq on sword point ? Indian muslims are a result of forceful conversion which happened during and after Babar invaded Bharat. Tell me you dont beleive it - and close your eyes on history
6/ THE ONLY TOLERANT AND ACCEPTABLE FORM of Islam is SUFISM, which has now been totally rejected by hardliners and has been compared to buth-parasti and kabar-parasti, strictly forbidden in Islam
I WANT PEACE IN OUR BELOVED MOTHER LAND AND IN THIS WORLD, BECAUSE WE WILL NOT LIVE HERE FOR ETERNITY...WE JUST WANT TO LIVE THE REMAINING FEW YEARS OF OUR LIFE IN PEACE
MUSLIM BROTHERS, PLEASE LIVE AND LET OTHERS LIVE IN PEACE
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Asrar Mohammed on Apr 01, 2007 06:14 PM Permalink
Dear Friend Indian: Answers: 1) Yes Hindus are Kaafirs bcz they are Non-Muslims and I am a Non-Hindu bcz I am a Muslim. But NO QURAN DOESNT ORDER TO KILL Kaafirs without any cause. It had ordered with some cause. Same as Indian Law gives the righ to defend if some one wants to kill u. 2) oo. that doesnt mean that they can kill all Non-Muslims. There is no compulsion in Islam, if u want u can believe and if u dont want u cant. It is a belief and I am not hear to defend that belief but I being a Muslim, I have to believe in it, but I have no right to make others make it believe on the point of sword. 3) Not all Muslims are perfect Muslims. No Muslim can call him a perfect Muslim unless he follows and practices all Islamic principles. Which means NO COMPULSION in religion matter. 4) As I said, not all Muslims are perfect and follow all the principles. There is definitely Tolerance to all believers and no force is to be used to convert other believers to Islam. 5) Is it, then how come the Hindus are in Majority more than 80% and Muslims in Minority. This proves that not all Indians were forced to convert, and if some one did they were against Islamic principles 6) Yes, SUFISM was created. And ISLAM doesnt allow innovations in it. But Believe ISLAM doesnt teach Muslims to Kill all INNOCENT Non-Muslims/
Yes, as an Indian Muslim, I will not kill any Innocent-Non-Muslims and neither I will make India a place of Hell, I will try to uplift my Nation and try to contribute to its growth as a Democratic and SECULAR country. So do I wish the same from my all Indians.
Peace will prevail in India, once all corrupt/selfish/criminal politicians are eradicated.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by play on Apr 01, 2007 06:19 PM Permalink
It seems like just like others you have completely mis - understood everything
I would like to say one thing first. DONT JUDGE ISLAM BY LOOKING AT THE MUSLIMS. Its like this I HAVE A BRAND NEW MERCEDEIS CAR AND I DO NOT KNOW HOW to DRIVE IT. SO I GO AND BANG THE CAR TO A TREE . NOW tell me is it fault of the CAR Or is it FAULT of the driver?
Its like you are blaming the car for all the fault of teh driver. The car has lots of un imagenable features and only a driver who properly drives the car can tell you what a mercidies is all about. So Now i can say that you are just like those people who have half information anything picked from here and there and also the wrong information portrtaid by the media which unfortunatley comes to your thinking.
As i had mentioned earlier that most of the hindu's in india feel that it is the muslims who are responsible for all of thier problems which is really ubsurd and out of context.
now coming to your point Yes hindu's are Kaafir's because hindu's are non- muslims. So are Christians, Sikhs, Buddist's, Jainism etc are all kaafir's. If you know a better Arabic term for Non- Muslims than better give one. Only an expert in Arabic language can give one and i doubt you know Arabic language as i can see that you do not know the meaning of kaafir in arabic.
Yes it is true, Islam believes in One God that is we call it Allah. And prophet (P.B.U.H ) is the Messenger of Allah. Like hinduism where there are 1000's of god's just like Tree is a god, Snake is a god, monkey is a god, elephant is a god, Iron is a god, stone is a god etc. The differance between Hinduism and Islam is the S. Where Hinduism says that everything is Islam says everything is God's. Yes Islam is open religion to all. (To get more details please refer to the DVD of Dr Zakir Naik - Similarities Between Hinduism and ISlam . which includes question and answer session where many hindu's has posed questions just like you. Please look into this )
DONT COMPARE SUFISM TO A GOOD ISLAM AS SUFISM IS NOT COMPLETE ISLAM> IT IS GOEING AGAINST THE TAUHEED OR TH E ONENESS OF ISLAM GOEING AGAINST THE Prophec (P.B.U.H)
I urge you to please refer to DR ZAKIR NAIK"S VCD/ DVD about the discussion betweeen Hinduism and Islam with Sri shree Guruji of The ART of Living Where all you r questions are answered.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by play on Apr 01, 2007 07:01 PM Permalink
Haa, MR Surya,
Well its the opposite of what you say. You yourself do not have any brains. Dr Zakir Naik is an expert in Hindu scriptures and he has studied it very well.He is the master of comparitive Religion. He is accepting any challenge ask him any question relating to Islam and Hinduism he can tell you that.Tell what and all relgious books have you read?
I am sure MR Surya you have not Seen his Debates with Hindu and christian scholor's.Its clearly mentioned in the Quran about people like you who will never lisiten. The Deaf, The Dumb the Blind . IF you explain and tell it to them a thousand times they will never understand.
You have a very limited knowledge of ISlam and always half knowledge is always dangerous. You are a dangeorous man and belive me this half knowledge will definatley kill in every way. Insha Allah.
You have the curse of Allah and surely and definatley you will never ever get the message. These Brahmin's who teach these things in thier patshala's (THE RSS ) has posioned the mind's of ordinary hindu's. One very BIg Fact . Hindu's are the Biggiest Minority in the country. (In the name of differant Caste) .
I am sure you Need some Psyciatric help. You have a very disturbed and troubled mind. Mostly because of the RSS Chamchas
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 07:19 PM Permalink
play, dun make him understand he was born swine n wud die swine (or i guess already died SOB)
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by An Indian on Apr 01, 2007 08:13 PM Permalink
Mr Play, a quote for you...
"The allegations against RSS of violence and hatred against Muslims are wholly false. Muslims should learn the lesson of mutual love, co-operation and organisation from RSS." - Dr. Zakir Hussain
RE:RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by play on Apr 01, 2007 08:26 PM Permalink
DR Zakir Hussain,
YOU MUST BE OUT OF YOUR MIND. RSS IS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. READ THIER BOOK THE BUNCH (PANCHASHEEL) OF THOUGHTS IN THAT IT HAS MENTIONED THIER NO1 ENEMY IS MUSLIM, NO 2 CHRISTIANITY NO3 COMMUNISTS? DONT YOU REMEMBER THE ATTROCITIES IT HAD DONE IN GUJRATH? EITHER YOUR MIS INFORMED OR YOU ARE NOT IN INDIA, RSS IS COMPLETLEY AGAINGST MUSLIMS.Reach thier bunch of thoughts.
RE:[object]
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 05:15 PM Permalink
btw hansraj juz check the whole forum and c if any muslim has made any comments abt the whole hindu community unlike what u have done this shows the difference of thoughts and the hatred u have for muslims so what do u expect in return mr hansraj wud expect a more civiliaed answer than ur previous post
RE:[object]
by play on Apr 01, 2007 05:04 PM Permalink
Mr Hans Raj,
Just that you saw one of muslim guy doeing it doesnt mean that all the muslims are anti indian. So Modi has comitted genocide it doesnt mean that all the hindu's are just like modi. It is really a stupid and non-technical way to give comparison. DONT JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER. Also DONT COMPARE THIS PARTICULAR INCIDENT TO ALL MUSLIMS. We love our motherland and each and everytime we need not proove our loyatly towards our motherland.
By the way to understand Islam and Muslims please make a good study about it. Read the Holy Quran and its meaning. You will know what the truth is. and by the way dont make these absurd statements and comparisons.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by yadav on Apr 01, 2007 08:26 PM Permalink
Asrar, What Chatterjee said is that u consider ur self indians first and then muslims. He is not saying u to forget that u r muslim. It is this kind of stupid mentality which gives u gus trouble where ever ur in the world.
the problem is that when a muslim calls himself a muslim he is reduced to be a non-indian and a paki by default my brother u talk abt thought clearing process if it had been so then tell me y this kinda talk in a forum where its strictly between an opportunist politician and muslims but u see the comments started by a non-muslim entity we have seen a society where we cant say that hindus r good or bad or muslims r good or bad u have all sort of ppl in every religion but ultimately it all melts down to hindu-muslim, very unfortunate
RE:RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by Asrar Mohammed on Apr 01, 2007 04:42 PM Permalink
Dear General, Its ur illusion in which you are made to live, I challenge u that no muslim in this world, is anti-non-muslim, if he says or beliefs to be Muslim. His religion doesnt teach him so. But every living being in this world has the right to defend, but dont understand the other way, he has no base or no right to be against humanity or against any human being of any belief without any proper cause. So come out of the wrong belief that Muslims are Anti-hindus. I have many educated hindu friends, I am not against them. Why should I be. But yes, good and bad people are everwhere and in every religion. I dont blame every Hindu for Gujrat riots, bcz I know that there were and are a handful of Hindus who are puppets in the hands of Politicans and are made to be against the Muslims. I hope u r not among those and neither I am. Understand this fact and unite and fight against these corrupt/selfish/criminal politicians and eradicate all evils from OUR home land.
RE:RE:RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by play on Apr 01, 2007 04:57 PM Permalink
Dear Asrar Mohammed,
I full accept and agree with you, The problem is since britsihers left india our politicians followed the goverining code of the britishers and unfortunatley they accepted the very bad part of it. That is Divide and rule. Now these politicians in the name of Nationalism and religion they are dividing these people.
The unfortunate part is that most of the Hindu's just get carried away with the anti- muslims remarks made by these politicians thus giving them the wrong information and blaming muslims for all the problems of their backwardness. All this is done is to gain power and make money for themselves. As i know myself mot of the Hindu's are not really aware about the Muslim religious practices which is mostly and more commonly mis-understood by the Hindu's.
As Islam says to respect all the religion and its faith it also says that "there is no compulsion in religion". There where times during the Prohpet (P.B.U.H) that he used to deal in business with the non muslims escpecially Jews.
It is our duty as muslims to convey the message of our Prohpet (P.B.U.H) to the non muslims. Escpeically the mis conceptions and wrong notions these non - muslims have about Islam and Muslim. I urge all hindu's to please refer to the Talk of Dr Zakir Naik on Similarities Between Hinduism and Islam. Its a very intersting topic and very informative.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by General Rambharose on Apr 01, 2007 01:09 PM Permalink
well said mr. chatterjee, this is the problem that u think every muslim thinks he doesnt belong to india I request u to come out of this thinking and see the changes for urself y dun u accept that they r indians first n then muslims
RE:[object]
by chinmoy chatterjee on Apr 01, 2007 01:27 PM Permalink
Dear Mr General, Another thing is last fifty yrs Muslims tried to stay on one platform,and u know the third law of Newton,so naturally now may be Hindus will try to come on one platform,-this will neither good for Muslims nor for the Hindus, as the advantage will be taken by the politicians. Pls stop them and do in favour of India's growth only. thanks.
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by khan on Apr 01, 2007 01:58 PM Permalink
Dear Chinmoy its not muslim willingly going on one platform,this is due to anti muslim pressure,and it became more stronger after 1989 "karsewa".Muslim got only one objective in mind that is how to keep the BJP and its allies out of power.they wer no longer loyal to congress,but started to vote to any guy who is able to defeat BJP and its allies,they started voting to congress,communist,bsp,sp,rjd, and so on,
RE:wake up muslims!!!!!!!!!!
by chinmoy chatterjee on Apr 01, 2007 01:22 PM Permalink
Dear General, I hv cleared my thought process now its yr turn. thanks.
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by chinmoy chatterjee on Apr 01, 2007 01:04 PM Permalink
u aus,-r u australian?If that then go there why u are creating problem here? If not why u r taking name of Ganguly here?
