How much will your shareholders suffer? Where are you, in Communist China?? stand up and look them eye to eye and tell them who funds their election campaigns and their social projects...our TAXES, the taxes of capitalist India! Stop cowering in a corner like a wimp and show that lungi clad loser what you're made of!
It is Indian Intelligensia that has mortgaged its brains and lost their ethics!
1. First myth is that producing Nano is akin to social service above good commercial sense; As Ratan Tata cleverly put it in a near social service tone when he said, WHEN I SAW A MAN DRIVING A TWO WHEELER WITH A CHILD STANDING BETWEEN HANDLEBAR AND SEAT WITH HIS WIFE SITTING BEHIND WITH A TODDLER IN HER LAP, I have firmed up my desire and decided to provide a safer option.
Wow! a Western entrepreneur would have put it straight - I SAW AN OPPORTUNITY instead of Ratan Tatas camouflaging a commercial opportunity into near social service.
2. Stating on a public platform that several names were considered for his 1 lac car including Mamta is being mischievous!
3. True you cant blame Ratan Tata for not dealing with the opposition parties in WB. I differ with Sushma Sengupta here. The businessmen should deal with the Government of the day; it is for the political parties how to solve issues among themselves.
3. It is the WB Govt that has lost its moral fabric in this deal and the entire intelligensia blogging so vociferously in favour of Ratan Tata.
4. In the first place, what ethical and moral right a GOvt has in forcing some poor farmers private property to another private entity called Tata Motors?
Compensation, hefty or otherwise, is a different matter altogether.
The bloggers claim that the farmers are already poor and their living cannot be better if they continue to
Re: WHEN INTELLIGENSIA MORTGAGED THEIR BRAINS AND LOST THEIR ETHICS!
by Sushma Sengupta on Sep 03, 2008 12:12 AM Permalink
I am not opposing Industralization.My point is relocation.Tata should respect local sentiments.Mamta might have personal or vested interest but the fact is even common people are opposing this project-- If part of project was shifted to other side of river,this issue would have never cropped up.
Re: WHEN INTELLIGENSIA MORTGAGED THEIR BRAINS AND LOST THEIR ETHICS!
by Anand Kumar on Sep 03, 2008 12:31 AM Permalink
Sushma, then why the Bengal government gave TATA a land? Wheren't they thinking the same you suggested here?
Re: WHEN INTELLIGENSIA MORTGAGED THEIR BRAINS AND LOST THEIR ETHICS!
by Kabeer on Sep 03, 2008 12:35 AM Permalink
dear Anand,
how on earth Govt of WB give a land that is not Govt land?
The Govt of WB twisted a bad law and through it it has usurped poor farmers lands and the judiciary is just watching.
How can they usurp someones property to give it to someone else? Both are private parties; one is poorer like the poor farmer and the other is richer and influential like Ratan Tata& Tata Motors.
Re: WHEN INTELLIGENSIA MORTGAGED THEIR BRAINS AND LOST THEIR ETHICS!
by AdfauunhAjrqQOmjh on Sep 03, 2008 12:16 AM Permalink
I agree. Tatas should relocate the plant outside Bengal. Why just across river. Silly girl. Don't let that Mamta *dominate* you.
Re: Re: WHEN INTELLIGENSIA MORTGAGED THEIR BRAINS AND LOST THEIR ETHICS!
by Kabeer on Sep 03, 2008 12:29 AM Permalink
Dear Sushma,
The primal point is how can Govt force a private owner to divest his holdings in favour of another private entrepreneur?
Acquire private property for public projects like roads, railways etc whose objective is not profit making is fine.
Or Give Govt land to private entrepreneurs for starting new industrial projects is also OK as you can decide what to do with your property since you are Govt.
But how on earth the civilised system in India including the Judiciary force a poor man to sell his holdings in favour of another private entrepreneur for his commercial project?
What kind of barbarian society that we are living in?
Is the Judiciary sleeping? or have they taken refuge in a bad law by upholding it?
Re: WHEN INTELLIGENSIA MORTGAGED THEIR BRAINS AND LOST THEIR ETHICS!
by Kabeer on Sep 03, 2008 12:22 AM Permalink
till the land is a naked display of Nazist thinking; like Hitler wanted to kill all children born with imperfections like autism etc., as they are a burden on society.
5. Arguments that the land cultivation is not generating enough wealth for societal good and hence be given away to Tata Motors at market prices is like sacrificing the basic principles that govern a civilised society based on democraticy at the altar of plutocracy.
Can the same people dare say when Tata Motors was in the red a few years ago, that since the company is in the red it should be wound up and its factory land be used for other purposes?
When they cant make that argument why forcing a poor farmer to sell his land at a rate predetermined by someone else?
Does someone dare Ratan Tata to learn farming by relinquishing managing Tata Motors when it was in the Red?
If you can not say that how can you tell the farmer to learn some other vocation instead of farming? If Ratan Tata can not learn farming how a deprived farmer can learn some other vocation, and why?
A farmer does not know any other vocation other than farming. The maximum compensation that you gave 4-8 lac per acre will be consumed in one fashior or other as he doesnot know how to make it as a capital and start a new vocation. If his capital is consumed what will he be left with after a few years?
Why a farmer be deprived of his holding on his invesment in his asset for a better price increase in future?
Beware of these DEMONS What they are doing looks beautiful and brilliant But they have Dark and Ugly side They have started systematic process of destroying the very basic needs of life PURE LAND PURE AIR PURE WATER
Ask youself what is the use of money, development, riches. When you are going to loose your health ?? What is the use of GOLD when you are dying for water??
The western countries have realized this and are so these industries are dumped on INDIA and CHINA
The comman man does not understand this, but our learned PM does , BUT he probably cares more about his Swiss bank account.
Re: THE TWO DEVILS TATA AND MANMOHAN
by V S on Sep 03, 2008 12:10 AM Permalink
so what do u want ? people should live in huts and poverty for another 1000 years ?
Re: THE TWO DEVILS TATA AND MANMOHAN
by mahendra raja on Sep 03, 2008 12:25 AM Permalink
May be we should back Bajaj , Maruti industries???? Or go back to stone age?
>> The middle path proposed is to retain 600 acres as required solely by tata motors to be there where it is, remaining 400 acres required for ancillary units to be moved to few km away in a low lying land which is not as fertile.
Yeah right. LOL! If you move the plant a few km away then the people there will start protesting that you are taking the most fertile agricultural land in the world.
You talk about ethics. Is it ethical for people to violently attack other people in the name of protest? To destroy property, to deny people their livelihood by using intimidation and violence as Mamata is doing?
Re: @Sengupta
by Sushma Sengupta on Sep 03, 2008 12:10 AM Permalink
i do not support Mamata,her methods are wrong but she does have a valid point.I repeat i am against Violence and i do not indulge in politics.I have addressed Tata as 'Ratanji' i dont have personal issues but fact is fact it cant be disorted to please some section ( industralist's ego)
Re: @Sengupta
by AdfauunhAjrqQOmjh on Sep 03, 2008 12:13 AM Permalink
Hi Sushmaji. You suck big time. *literally* :). Note, I have addressed you as Sushmaji.
Re: Re: Mamata banerjee might have taken billions of crores from foreighn automobile companies ....
by thomas tharakan on Sep 03, 2008 12:08 AM Permalink
Communisim has been degraded to fool the common man in india..in china companies open up everyday and nobody makes has problems. In india 2 states are controlled have communist parties kerala and bengal an in both not a single company can survive. If you know anybody supporting communism tell them to think again now. We should spread this word now to all our friends in India. We want to see india prosper and not be a pawn, the communists have the undeserved power over the masses and are not thinking to use it for their good.
People Say Tata are ethical.. But Chanakya has said " Business and ethics dont go hand in hand". Tata or Narayan murthy of Infosys may wear mask of ethics but truth is every corporate in India and all over world are grown on basis of manipulation and unethical work.But unethical means varies from corporates to corporates.Reliance may do more,tata may do less-- But every corporate does unethical work.Talking about bribes even Tata have paid bribes- So no ones saint in corporate world. Now let us come to the moot point :
First, let your own land or house or property gobbled up in the interest of an industry and then comment. This is the most fertile zone of WB. Some distance way in infertile land other industries are coming up without any difficulty. Ratanji made several mistakes which he might not acknowledge but remains answerable to shareholders and making the industrial climate state of WB, and the country hostage first with his follies and then with veiled threats. He is trying to equate Nano with India iteself which is a dangerous thing to do.First, let be Nano on road for few years, perform and then we start clapping. Now onto his mistakes
Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by Sushma Sengupta on Sep 03, 2008 12:03 AM Permalink
i)Why did he only depend on only overwhelming majority of CPIM in state of WB, not bothering to talk to prinicipal oppositions or local people as in politics things might change. Did he believe that CPIM is ruling Bengal for 30 years and will continue to do so for another 30 and he doesn't need to bother??ii) underestimating opponent - in nano naming function he said that he wanted to name it 'Buddha', 'Mamata' and 'despite Mamata' thinking the battle is already won. One can make fun of his friend if he doesn't mind but wasn't it prematured to make fun of Mamata (iii) Ratanji very boisterously said that some other car manufacturing co. is instigating trouble in Singur, he has proof and would reveal it at appropriate time. When will that time come now that he is deciding to leave Singur, eating his own words?iv) what if supreme court says the method in which a fertile, irrigable land was acquired without owner's consent in the name of public interest and given to a private profit making company is illegal? did he ever look at legal, constitutional issues? Tatas have many other manufacturing facilities in WB doing very well and nobody opposes it.
Re: Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by Sushma Sengupta on Sep 03, 2008 12:04 AM Permalink
Why is it here? One should have the patience to understand the problem and act like a narcisist. What is then the way out? The middle path proposed is to retain 600 acres as required solely by tata motors to be there where it is, remaining 400 acres required for ancillary units to be moved to few km away in a low lying land which is not as fertile. It may increase the cost of the car by approx. 5000 INR. Is this Ratanji's ego that 1 lakh is 1 lakh and if it is 1.05 is the ego is hurt or Nano becomes unprofitable? Which other car is competing with it in that price range? It is time accept mistakes and apologise to the people of Singur as well as shareholders of Tata Motors for the mistakes made by him and move forward or if the chorus, JLR acquirer's ego is so much inflated let the job be given to somebody else.I request the readers to take note of the fact how people in and around Singur oerwhlmingly voted for Mamata. These were the places where CPIM was ruling. Why is it so? In a democracy you should learn to respect peoples wishes. Unfortunately, very few of us believe in democracy and mostly feudal in nature. We want to decide what is good for others. We worry about youth not getting job if there is no industry because our kids are to serve in industry? Will we stop eating? Who will cultivate land and where? Industry can shift to an infertile land but cultivation cannot. We want others to sacrifice. How much sacrifice we ourselves have made?
Re: Re: Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by Sushma Sengupta on Sep 03, 2008 12:04 AM Permalink
p.s I am neither a bengali nor my name is Sushma Sengupta.. So dont judge my comment on basis of my name.Reality bites
Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by Dhipu Murali on Sep 03, 2008 12:10 AM Permalink
Neverthless, you have to take that bite.Because, then it is not just the corporates who wear the mask of ethics. Its everyone, you, me ans everybody.
Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by AdfauunhAjrqQOmjh on Sep 03, 2008 12:11 AM Permalink
You must be missing Mamata. Anyway, this is democracy. Who cares whether you are sushi or sushma? BTW, what is your pet name sushi or sushu?
Re: Re: Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by Anand Kumar on Sep 03, 2008 12:18 AM Permalink
Shushma, Your thoughts are basically saying the West Bengal politicians are public is way too screwed up.
TATA is business man and he doesn't need to go door to door to ask for permission. People of Bengal elected their government and TATA got approvals from them.. Period!!
Re: The Inside Truth - Nano,Tata's Ego & Harsh reality
by Anand Kumar on Sep 03, 2008 12:14 AM Permalink
Your thoughts are well compiled but too naive..I am sorry. And I bet Mamta and whoever his supporters are probably have similar thoughts as you do here.
Every businessman around the world is oppertumistic and that's what build the successful business empire. Looks at China, the most oppertunist country in the world and the growth they brought to their people. US the super power is another example.
West Bengal folks must understand the growth, infrastructure and benefits to the local that Tata will bring.
I have dealt with Tata and I must say it's one of the most uncorrupt company exist in India. I think the best move for TATA is to leave West Bengal and move some where else. And the time will show Bengal what they have lost..
The foreign countries do NOT want India to be a Leader in this or other segment. Withe the oil situation THIS is the car of the future for commuting. Even the big companies of the WORLD cannot make it for the cost and quality.
People are wait listed for "Smart Car' from EU. It look identical to nano, but $30,000/car.
Ratan Tata was set up the Bengal Politicians, they knew all along once Tata is neck deep into it, they will start playing games and blackmail him. HE should move the plant OUT of India, this is the only way these shameless politicians will learn. Thats what Wal-Mart did to cut the American labor to size as did the Auto industries to UAW.
Re: This is a slap fpr India and NOT W Bengal
by Ravi Rajendran on Sep 03, 2008 12:04 AM Permalink
Yes the car of future...We have seen lots of HIGH END and so called HI-TECH cars from Tata. Indica is the best example. I still remember how I sold my 2006 Indica when there were no buyers. Mark my words, NANO will be utter failure and I wish it doesnt hit road. Cant see traffic jams daily
Re: Re: This is a slap fpr India and NOT W Bengal
by Anand Kumar on Sep 03, 2008 12:25 AM Permalink
Also Ravi, The same was said about Smart Car from germany few years ago and today they have 2 yrs wait for Smart Car...just like Bajaj used to be in 80's where you have to wait 10 yrs before you get your scooter..
Re: This is a slap fpr India and NOT W Bengal
by Anand Kumar on Sep 03, 2008 12:23 AM Permalink
I take Indica anyday over Maruthi Suzuki or Hyundai. Mind you the Nano is already in high demand in under devloped countries with TATA already have pending orders..
