Besides, all Indians must know how the Indian deal compares with the Chinese deal
http://www.indianexpress.com/story/212219.html
Reading all the articles in tandem an ordinary unbiased Indian can arrive at the same conclusion what all the experts in India have been saying that the deal is good for the country.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 07:52 PM Permalink
I suggest to everyone to read the articles in the above link provoded by Vikas. Its a must read. This should make clear to the rest of our countrymen who still are nt convinced abt the Deal, hw important the deal is for us and what a wonderful job Team Manmohan has done in gettin this deal without givin away nethn. Plz read it
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 08:23 PM Permalink
We may have got a "better" deal than China, but that doesnt quite translate into a "good" deal . The deal will produce 7% of our energy requirement for the next 40 years, provided India has a foreign policy congruent to US, halt further development of nuclear arsenal, and supports US in isolating new nuclear states(read Iran). its as simple as that... You don't have to be a nuclear scientist to understand this. If this is acceptable, everything is fine. The complete text of the 123 agreement, the Hyde act and the nuclear deal with china is available here. http://www.xrl.us/4jp8
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Kaushik Basu on Aug 29, 2007 10:07 PM Permalink
There is a catch to what you are saying. US at this stage don't need a proof to isolate you. It can do it on any pretext and no one would come forward in support. Instead if you are in a deal with US and if there is a difference of opinion, US would try to negotiate its way through to safeguard its financial interests, which it would not have if you are not in deal. Therefore you would be more safe even with difference of opinion apart from getting benefits if you are in deal than otherwise.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 10:13 PM Permalink
If the US can get out so can we. Why do u think we are weak n we cannot face the challenges the US might force on us in the future. We are growing, n we are growin fast. We beleive the US cannot dictate terms to us. If the US puts in conditions, we have every right to reject it if we thnk its nt in our interest. World politics is all about give n take. The US is no angelto give us everythn for free. Why the US look at urself would u be willing to part with half of ur salary with ne one. Obviously nt as its ur hard earned money. Same here. We have the weigh our options n thn come to a conclusion. Foregn policy cannot be run on principles and old ideology. Its national interests that drives foreign policy. Nobody is in love with the US here. its all about where our interest lie.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 10:42 PM Permalink
How does the the deal make the US boss here. This deal is on equal terms though the fact remains we cannot match the US superiority at this time, still its on equal terms. U have contradicted ur own words here. U say India wants to be a superpower whers the US is already a super power, so the fact is the US is superior right now and we are workin hard to be more powerful than the US still under these circumstance the deal is on equal terms. What s the crtical thng abt the deal being for 40 years, kinly elaborate further on this...
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 10:22 PM Permalink
US is the boss in this deal and thats the problem.. why not go for a deal on equal terms if India is/want to be a super power. The fact that the deal is for 40 long years is of critical importance.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 10:15 PM Permalink
Well.. Kaushik,, to say we have to go into this deal cause US may some day isolate us, is not acceptable.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 10:24 PM Permalink
Who says the US will isolate us. And yes i don care if they plan to do that, u knw why, bcoz after 60 years of independence we have got the strength and confidence to face any challenge and we know nobody can harm us. thats or strength our confidence and most importantly our hardwork. We are scared of neone.
RE:RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by vikas sethi on Aug 29, 2007 11:34 PM Permalink
George,
Most of the pt in the hyde act are cosmetic for non proliferation hawks in US. They r all non binding clauses.It is like indian govt saying US is working for Indian interests bcoz it is following a policy in Pak that suits us. We cannot force US to continue that policy, Can we?
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 30, 2007 07:28 AM Permalink
lol.. who made the hyde act? US makes the terms. I dont know why are bringing in bravery and cowardace in.. it as question of intellect and comon sense not bravery.
RE:RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 30, 2007 12:21 AM Permalink
give us proof of US makin terms and we obeying them. Dont just bark show the proof. U r a coward and will always remain so george
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 10:35 PM Permalink
@Batman This is the response to the question "What makes u say India is playin second fiddle to the US.????" Jusr read the hyde act. How about India passing an act on same grounds
(B) the country has a functioning and uninterrupted democratic system of government, has a foreign policy that is congruent to that of the United States, and is working with the United States in key foreign policy initiatives related to non-proliferation;
(C) such cooperation induces the country to implement the highest possible protections against the proliferation of technology related to weapons of mass destruction programs and the means to deliver them, and to refrain from actions that would further the development of its nuclear weapons program; and
(D) such cooperation will induce the country to give greater political and material support to the achievement of United States global and regional nonproliferation objectives, especially with respect to dissuading, isolating, and, if necessary, sanctioning and containing states that sponsor terrorism and terrorist groups, that are seeking to acquire a nuclear weapons capability or other weapons of mass destruction capability and the means to deliver such weapons;
RE:RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 10:30 PM Permalink
@Batman ofcourse we are not. My objection of the deal has nothing to do with the fear factor.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 09:36 PM Permalink
@ Batman Instead of saying "u r wrong" why dont you post the right analysis.
How does these terms sound to you?
(B) the country has a functioning and uninterrupted democratic system of government, has a foreign policy that is congruent to that of the United States, and is working with the United States in key foreign policy initiatives related to non-proliferation;
(C) such cooperation induces the country to implement the highest possible protections against the proliferation of technology related to weapons of mass destruction programs and the means to deliver them, and to refrain from actions that would further the development of its nuclear weapons program; and
(D) such cooperation will induce the country to give greater political and material support to the achievement of United States global and regional nonproliferation objectives, especially with respect to dissuading, isolating, and, if necessary, sanctioning and containing states that sponsor terrorism and terrorist groups, that are seeking to acquire a nuclear weapons capability or other weapons of mass destruction capability and the means to deliver such weapons;
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 10:15 PM Permalink
What makes u say India is playin second fiddle to the US. give us proof of that
RE:RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 09:59 PM Permalink
Have faith in the new India George and plz get rid of ur inferiority complex and the fear psychosis regarding the US. We ll make sure India is compromised in any way. Power respects Power and we have enough power. Dont project India as weak to the world plz.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 09:57 PM Permalink
The Hyde Act is a cosmetic effect to shut the mouths of the Non Proliferation hawks in Washington who vehemently oppose this deal. It can neva and will neva bind India into anything. The US understands it has no leverage to stop India from testign weapons. The US will not withdraw from the deal neither will it impose sanctions on India as it has billions of dollars of investment in India. Remember 1998 whn US imposed sanctions on India and has to finally bite the dust whn they realized it was their companies that were suffering the most. So chill the time for us has come to give India its due place on the world stage. Nuthn ca stop India now frm becoming a superpower. The left traitors will go to hell with their chinese masters. Chinas plan of containment and suppresing India to third world status will be defetead.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 10:06 PM Permalink
I have no inferiority complex. I think India is better than US and can do very well without playing second fiddle to US in this deal.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by george on Aug 29, 2007 09:52 PM Permalink
Our deal is definitley better than the Chinese, "technically".... But the hyde act has terms which are ambigous( The ones in my previous posts). Bush "says" they are not binding" but the act doesnt.
RE:What Pakistan & China Feel.....
by Batman on Aug 29, 2007 09:44 PM Permalink
How can a deal that is better than one that china got be a bad deal for India. Everyone knows the economic rise of china. Now this rise requires power. This deal gives us more than wot the chinese got and the chinese are known for the shrewdness with qwhich they protect their interests. Surely we have protected our interests better than the chinese. As per co operation with America is considered, wots wrong with that. U sure don wanna pursue a isolationist policy. If one has to be recognized as a global player thn one has to play global politics. Aliging with countries is one such global game to gain maximum from the current prevailing world conditions. What u suggest is we breakin relations with everyone and just become isolated from the rst of the world. And i dont understand ur fears of the whites. Even after 60 years of independence u have a fear Psychosis vis a vis the Whites and the US in particular. Even after 60 years u r nt confident abt ur freedom and the strength to keep that freedom. U still think u will be enslaved. tell me why dosn the Americans think India will capture the US and enslave the americans through this deal, thats bcoz they are strong and confident and very agressive. Same feelings should be here in us Indians.
