Many of them say, you are Indian first, then Hindu. I will tell them to ask this question to any Muslim, They will say we are Muslim first and then Indian. Because Islam advocates Islam first, then everything will follow. But our Media is fooling stupid hindus in name of patriotism. If muslim says he is Indian first, then either he is telling lie, or he dont follow Islam.
The day, Muslim will start feeling that they are indian first, all the problem will go away.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by doremon on Apr 26, 2007 03:26 PM Permalink
if i say i am a hindu or muslim first does not make u unpatriotic religion is personal but when staying in a society you have to identify will that land only and its rules WHICH IN INDIA IS SECULARISM THAT IS NO STATE RELIGON
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 06:22 AM Permalink
Altho I do not believe in any religion but I have always been talking to people of different religions and I have taken good values from all of them. As far as Islam goes, it is about worshipping one God, so I wonder how worshipping one God can come in way of loving your country. Please correct me if I am wrong. Thanks.
RE:[object MouseEvent]
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 06:26 AM Permalink
it's not about one god or half god. The point is about inherent nationalism and rampant separatism. Muslims collectively have always got issues with the rest in India. Individual cases are of no value.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 06:36 AM Permalink
This is a stereotype. The International community and different international conventions have addressed the problems of minorities in different parts of the world.
1) A demand for independant Scottland is not made by muslims. 2) A demand for separate Tamil Ealam is not made by Muslims. 3) A demand to for a separate land my the mizo/naga xyz is not placed by the muslims. 4) East Timor was a part of Indonesia but because it has majority christan population they got themselves another country. 5) Irish are still fighting the british to get freedom.
These are all political issues and as you can see all these issues have taken violent forms at some point or the other. All these issues involved people from all the communities. It wrong to see political problems as religious problems.
RE:[object MouseEvent]
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 06:40 AM Permalink
scots, tamils, mizos have issues from race, culture dating back to many millenia in the lands they fight. They look different and do things differently from the people they fight and they are fighting only in recent times. Tamils were in lanka 2000 years ago too. Now the national identities are becoming strong and the minorities have to face the ire of the rest is the reason these people fight. Muslims are separatist everywhere they live. Pick a place.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 06:46 AM Permalink
You say: "minorities have to face the ire of the rest is the reason these people fight"
Isnt this true for the muslims as well? Why are you having different scales for different people?
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by CG GANG on Apr 26, 2007 08:02 AM Permalink
Thats the law of nature doode. MInorites where ever they go have to face a problem. Be it any religion, nationality, Color, State.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 06:49 AM Permalink
well, muslims have fought once and separated India. So why the hell should i see India screwed up again? Why were Hindus cleansed, or converted deliberately in millions from 1947 to now in Pakistan and Bangladesh? why the double standards?
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 06:56 AM Permalink
So you mean you will convert the muslims to hinduism ? or you will kill them ? Dont you think India will become a country like bangladesh and Pakistan ? I dont want to see that happen to my country. you can give it a try.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 07:01 AM Permalink
so what you want to see Gandhi. Suggest solutions. Don't just blabber. Even Gandhi had no solution when it came to this problem. You are just another guy talking peace. Gandhi was great at that and he falied. So i don't expect solutions from you.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 07:09 AM Permalink
On earlier point you supported Mizos saying that they are an ancient race. So you also support a separate Mizoram and Nagaland like Bhutan ?
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by Nirpinder Singh on Apr 26, 2007 06:40 AM Permalink
Does this comment have anything to do with the news story? We are in a sad state if we link state sponsored crime with Religious sentiments.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 06:19 AM Permalink
you say "all the problem will go away"
1) Will poverty go away? 2) Will less people die of aids? 3) Will corruption go away? 4) Will there be education to all ? 5) Will India have a social security system? 6) Will there be flood/drought management in place? 7) Will castism end ? The answer to all of this is no. The only way we can build a nation is by concentrating our energies to growth and not in dividing the country. There are far bigger problems looming over India than terrorism. So to the people who are stimulated more by hinduism than by Indianism I would like to tell them that if there are 85% hindus in India than Aids is a 85% problem of hindus because this desease has no religion.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 06:24 AM Permalink
this "eclipse" is a crackpot. What's the point in concentration energies on growth when nation is not secure and strong? learn history dude. Morons like you will always predict sh!t.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by CG GANG on Apr 26, 2007 07:53 AM Permalink
Nation becomes strong through religion, power economics, technology and agriculture. Chaitanya ur an idiot who justs sees a small picture
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 08:08 AM Permalink
Sure. agriculture, technology play their role.If Muslims are a problem, it becomes a religion problem and that becomes everybody's problem. That is why i bring religion into discussion. So call me communal now jackass.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by eclipse on Apr 26, 2007 06:27 AM Permalink
So how do you plan to make the nation strong ? by killing fellow Indians ? Or by giving a helping had to the other indians who are working towards the betterment of the society? I will answer your question in your own language.
Is India SECURE enuf to face the challenge of Aids? Is India STRONG enuf to face the challenge of corruption? Is India STRONG enuf to support its poor masses?
I agree with you: "nation is not secure and strong"
RE:RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 26, 2007 06:37 AM Permalink
hey man, i have discussed these points a million times before in this forum. I can assure you that i won the debate ultimately :-) I am tired to explain again. Come out of the innocent attitude and remove the blinkers. India can only grow and get rid of it's issues when nation is secure and strong. History is the reminder. India's GDP share of the world was 32 % in sevent century and soon fell down to 25 % few years after Prophet Mohammed revealed his prophecy. It was around 2 % in 1947. I am sure India had less issues of poverty, aids in the beginning. It's not about killing Indians or kicking them out. I am being practical, learning from history. Good national security is always the key and people should come together to portray their oneness and not behave like separatist nutcases. Without being strong and secure, India will fall again. Remember that.
RE:[object MouseEvent]
by Golden on Apr 26, 2007 07:23 AM Permalink
don believe him. he is coward like most of other pseudo patriots of india. the moment you start talking them and start catching them. they will fly away. i shall recommend you study indian culture, its religions and hindu sanatan dharma. you will know the reality of this and culture. if possible study islam also and then you will know why a muslim is so strong on his faith and why they claim their faith is correct. truth speaks for itself. it doesnt need proof. islam gives its proof in every creature the only requirement is you must be impartial while looking at them. when talibans kidnapped a Christian lady the whole world started boiling on this and almost every media of the world gave news about the butality of talibans. when she was released, non of them even came forward to take an interview of that christian lady. because she came out with the true perspective of islam and talibans. she gave an statement that if a muslim captures you, you can be killed or murdered but you can never be raped. i ask what is the most shamful situation for a woman? yes it is being raped. and go in gujrat and see how many woman were raped in the name of religion. and these communal forces support it in the name of their pseudo patriotism. just read the hisrtory of all the religions with impartial mind and you will come to the truth.
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by Manoj Bhadani on Apr 26, 2007 07:30 AM Permalink
Why are you not asking me to go to Kashmir, Bangladesh and Pakistan where the rapes are uncountable now. This is the partiality and knowledge which you lack. I have never seen a Muslim in India condemning incidents in these parts of the world. Hindus are fearless and open in their approach. They see people not based on their religion but as human beings first. Gujarat was an incident not commendable. You need to learn fiest that it was a repercussion to the incident of Godhra and movements such as this is hate and nothing else. Learn the root causes before commenting....
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by on May 02, 2007 04:29 PM Permalink
i dont buy ur views mr. i have been living in gujarat for the last 20 years and can safely say that its the most safset state.
RE:[object MouseEvent]
by wsj wsj on Apr 26, 2007 07:27 AM Permalink
Golden, Your analogy of getting raped worse than getting murdered is kinda twisty. Not buying!
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by Golden on Apr 26, 2007 07:16 AM Permalink
you won the debate...don't be a egoist...i remember you were the guy who fled when i started talking about sanatan dharma (or so called hindu dharma). your name attracted me but now i know you are just JAD not CHETAN. you have no sense...you are a great hypocrite.
RE:RE:RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by doremon on Apr 26, 2007 03:30 PM Permalink
INDIA HAS BEEN INVADED SINCE TIME IMMEMORIABLE THAT IS BECAUSE WE HAD NO UNITY WE WERE JUST PLAIN THIS IS THE BITTER TRUTH JUST DIFFERENT KINGDOMS HAVING A COMMON CULTURE WITH I REPEAT EVEN AT THAT TIME PEOPLE OF THE SAME CULTURE IN DIFFERENT RELIGONS
RE:To alll pseudo secularist
by wsj wsj on Apr 26, 2007 07:12 AM Permalink
Says who @ share of GDP. Stop giviing us Bull unless you went in your time machine and used the economterics tools developed in your gragae basements.
