RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by galilio on Mar 19, 2008 11:12 AM Permalink
culture to build good roads and highways were started by bjp government and congress do not follow this but show interest in sethu samudram project which is no use to commonman but only to few ship owners of smaller vessels which are owned by balu group of companies.congress will not give any development.bjp is better than congress if not very good.
RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by Hebbar R on Mar 19, 2008 01:00 PM Permalink
You are right. Infact, the Congress spent money to remove boards with Vajpayee's pix on the Golden Quadrilateral besides slowing down the project.
RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by peter pan on Mar 21, 2008 09:07 AM Permalink
I guess what you want to say is that Atalji spent quite some amount putting up his own pix for the Golden Quadrilateral project? Removing it... I'll do it for free if they let me keep the metal boards..
RE:RE:RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 04:59 AM Permalink
Obviously, if Congress is going to continue the project for another 5 yrs then why should Atal claim credit for it??
RE:RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by A p on Mar 19, 2008 11:31 AM Permalink
Upendra, in Indian politics only thing absolutely certain is surprise!
RE:RE:RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by Hebbar R on Mar 19, 2008 01:00 PM Permalink
Infact there is no surprise in this at all!!!
RE:Very good analysis ... I hope the Congress is really thinking same
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 04:57 AM Permalink
let us dispatch them to China... That is the right place for them??
The analysis makes sense. Point one needs to note is that the Political parties play all their games only with the intention of winning the next elections and gaining power. The interest of the Nation sadly seems to have no priority at all.
RE:Congress has Left in debt trap
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 05:03 AM Permalink
If that was so, then perhaps Congress wouldn't have gone for economic liberalization in the 90's, then perhaps Congress wouldn't have decided to make India a nuclear power, and also perhaps the Congress wouldn't be as willing to sign the nuclear deal with the US. Don't you realize that all these steps are being taken by the Congress not to win votes but to make India stronger. The only thing BJP, MNS, Shiv Sena and their likes are good for is breaking up the nation and getting back into power.
RE:Congress has Left in debt trap
by jack back on Mar 20, 2008 08:29 PM Permalink
don't forge BJP was JanSangh & they started party for the sake,progress & strength of India. What they believed then was ultimately adopted by congress in 90's. Had they not waited to do so until 90's then !!!!!
Also try to figure out the actual consequences of congress policy until 90's, facts not fictions & dogmas, please.
RE:Congress has Left in debt trap
by peter pan on Mar 21, 2008 09:12 AM Permalink
The only reason BJP has grown in stature is because they have been following the same tricks that were played by the Britties. Divide and Rule. Had they never talked about religion, they would probably never have made it in Indian politics. Indian politics is today a politics of division, we have people like Raj, the BJP and yo name it, whoever talks of region, religion, caste, sect or language is on his way to becoming a demi-god. We have forgotten all the lessons we learnt from the British and are heading right back to where we came from.
Indian govt are busy in buying expaired ships from USA and Russia. Indian navy become garbage place to dump their old ships. BJP govt.will also follow the same policy. may be they will create new minister to deal such things. no party opposed in parlment about this deal but only left makes some sound against the deal with USA ( they keep quite about the deal with Russia and most of the media didnot report the issue with its importency...Think in which direction India moves
RE:Oh.. my India
by abhishek gupta on Mar 19, 2008 11:53 AM Permalink
India is a garbage dumping ground for many other things as well, remember the westland helicopters. Unless we have honest leaders which means an active public and mature media, this will continue
RE:Oh.. my India
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 05:54 AM Permalink
If we don't buy ships from US and Russia and we are not presently capable of making them ourselves then who do you think we should buy the ships from? Should we buy them from China or Pakistan?
... anyways given the fact the govt has hardly doen anything but ink extremely controversial deasl with us . not sure why voters whould bring them back
sample this :
the navy is forced to buy a ship they cannot use in war
nuclear deal is in conflict with Hyde act which effectively vetoes any clause in the deal to India's benefit
We waste a lot of time bad mouthing left , to be blunt - Left has unwillingly done some good to us by restraining this Italian mafia CIA sponsered govt
Post BJP govt and the landmark golden quad project, I have not seen a single positive step taken by congress except crappy election programs like encouraging folks to borrow liek idiots and encouraging incompetent peopel to join IIT and AIIMS
I am sick of this congress govt - god knows what India has doen to suffer from this Nehru legacy and its mediocrity
Poor Gandhi never thought he would give India such a big national burden (Nehru and his descendants) we cannot wash our hands off ....
RE:good analysis ... but elections will be fought in alliances
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 05:19 AM Permalink
Well there are some of us who can keep crying, and some of us who can see the good side and take the right step. You must not forget that it is Nehru (and others along with him) who chose to make India a democracy. (You can contrast India with Pakistan, which became independent at the same time as India and realize what a filthy mess Pakistan is in). You must not forget that at the time of independence India was totally dependent on foreign countries for all its needs. We saw the green revolution under the congress. We saw IT sector rise and grow. And the very fact that we can dream of reaching a superpower status in another 25-30 years, and that too when it has been only 60 years since our independence, it goes on to prove that Nehru did in some way set India forth on the right foot. Things don't change in a day. And those who promise change in a day are all liars. But it is important that we do not lose our direction, that we see the right path. There are countless distractions on the path to success. Politicians will come and try to divide the country on religion, region, language and caste. They will promise to wipe out corruption in a day (even when they themselves are born right out of it). But we must keep on the right path and keep the future in mind.
RE:good analysis ... but elections will be fought in alliances
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 05:22 AM Permalink
dear abhishek bose, I'd like to ask you one little question... who do you think we should buy our ships from? you really seem to know a lot? or i guess you are interested in making us one?
RE:good analysis ... but elections will be fought in alliances
by roque francis on Mar 19, 2008 11:08 AM Permalink
In india all political parties play all types of games to be in power. Interest of nation is at the bottom of their agenda. I think we all indians should realise that. We all should vote for elligible person rather than party of caste or religion. I thinks we have got good PM and FM. They have done a good job(Still can be better).
RE:good analysis ... but elections will be fought in alliances
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 05:43 AM Permalink
Perhaps Mr Abhishek Bose, you want India to buy ships from China? (Just because they have a red flag with a sickle on it - and absolutely no soul or conscience)
Whatever, this is the last time the left will ever come to power or be power brokers at the Centre. Thats why they are making the feeling last till the end. Plain and simple stuff
RE:The Left is sucking a lemon !
by Bikash Saha on Mar 19, 2008 12:52 PM Permalink
Left is sucking lemon for the poor, others are suching blood of the poor.
World is afraid of Chaina, that's why people are afraid to boycott Olimpics game 2008. What excuse world give that athletic will be robed of their chance to participate. World people are willing to sacrifice lives of thousands of Tibetans but they wants Olympic to go on, on the dead body of Tibetans.
RE:RE:RE:RE:BOYCOTT OLYMPIC 2008
by Bikash Saha on Mar 19, 2008 12:44 PM Permalink
India will not get any medal. At least we can save our face by byctting the game in this issue.
RE:RE:RE:BOYCOTT OLYMPIC 2008
by Bikash Saha on Mar 19, 2008 12:44 PM Permalink
India will not get any medal. At least we can save our face by byctting the game in this issue.
RE:BOYCOTT OLYMPIC 2008
by Bikash Saha on Mar 19, 2008 12:43 PM Permalink
India will not get any medal. At least we can save our face by byctting the game in this issue.
Sonia actually has the left in a constitutional trap. Both the heads of the Lok sabha and rajya sabha are left candidates. Will they dissolve their own houses?
RE:Constitutional trap
by All Right on Mar 19, 2008 09:21 AM Permalink
Nagesh. Lok sabha and Rajya sabha heads are from left since when? Yesterday? If not, then they have always had this dilemma of dissolving own house everytime they wielded the threat to government on the nuke issue. Where does Sonia come into the picture now?
RE:Constitutional trap
by Visitor on Mar 19, 2008 10:02 AM Permalink
Since when have the heads of LokSabha & Rajya sabha ( Speaker & vice president) been given the authority to dissolve their own houses ??
RE:Constitutional trap
by All Right on Mar 19, 2008 12:04 PM Permalink
If Left withdraws support, that's what the speakers of the respective houses will have to do, dissolve their own houses, ain't it?
RE:Constitutional trap
by peter pan on Mar 20, 2008 05:59 AM Permalink
The speaker does not normally vote in the house unless it is a tie and is supposed to stay impartial.
RE:Constitutional trap
by All Right on Mar 20, 2008 01:04 PM Permalink
Even assuming speaker is not required to vote, and the voting determines that the government does not enjoy majority. Who officially dissolves the house then?
Shenoy has come up with an very good analysis and highlighted the political acumen of the PM/FM combination. I am sure they will get another chance to overcome some of thier failings in the first UPA. Sadly, next time around they may not have the luxury of a gentle and responsible Left. It may be the bullies Maya and Lalu trying to be PM and FM interchangeably by negotiation. PM/FM Lalu might may not be a bad idea. PM Maya or FM Mays seems to be scary.
It is quite a laboured and contorted arguement that made little sense and a whole lot of unrealistic conjectures. It is worded in a way to provide the author with an escape route in the event of any possibility unfolding. Quite a letdown really
RE:Laboured argument
by All Right on Mar 19, 2008 09:18 AM Permalink
Is the signing of nuke deal unrealistic? Is the constant threat from Left that they will withdraw support should the nuke deal be signed, a conjecture? Well, you may think what you have to. Most readers didn't feel that it was a letdown actually.
RE:RE:Laboured argument
by Visitor on Mar 19, 2008 10:00 AM Permalink
You see I do no assume on behalf of "most readers" like you do. And err...your questions do not "follow" from my comment !!
RE:Laboured argument
by All Right on Mar 20, 2008 01:07 PM Permalink
Visitor. There is no "assumption". It is for real that a nuke deal is waiting crucial signatures. You feel I assumed it, your problem. And err... my questions follow on from your comment, coz you were saying that the author makes unrealistic conjectures.
There are too many ifs and buts in the Senoy-Article that makes the analysis to be close to amusing. Mr. Senoy is perhaps ignorant about the financial support that the government of the day has been paying out to the Banking System, in all these years to implement its (including the period of BJP) Agriculture Policies. And the Rs. 60,000 Crore includes the bad debts that has already been written off by banks due to stricter reporting policy which has been introduced about 3 to 4 years back. For that the Government had made a hefty contribution then.
And, the actual hand-out from the Government will thus only to be too minimal to make any dent on the economy.
And if it so, the whole analysis is nothing but a bad hypothesis.
And when the FM and PM are telling that they have their home-work done properly, we have to believe them.
RE:Hypothesis
by sri on Mar 18, 2008 11:46 PM Permalink
I dont really see much clarity in your objections but Shenoy's is an interesting analysis, unlike the usual journalistic half-witted comments we normally see in Indian news outlets.
And why should we believe the FM and PM about having done their homework?
RE:Hypothesis
by Visitor on Mar 19, 2008 09:04 AM Permalink
If you cannot trust this PM & FM to have done their homework......you got trust issues man !!! :P:P
RE:Hypothesis
by All Right on Mar 19, 2008 09:22 AM Permalink
As if the entire parliament has been running smoothly since inception and every politician knows what s/he is doing.
RE:Hypothesis
by Lalatendu Deo on Mar 19, 2008 03:22 PM Permalink
My point, Sri, is that the Rs. 60,000 Crore is such a big amount that unless it is fully provisioned for, it would threaten the entire economy !!! It is more than the entire budget of 3 big States, taken together. And the Waiver has been a well thought out announcement by the FM and is not just a half-backed one.
We must go into the details of the Waiver Clauses and the earlier budgets of this government, before making any analysis. A lot of these money has already been written off from the books of account of the Banks due to the Change in reporting of Bad Debts that the RBI had dictated some 4 years back. The Banks were earlier showing these amount as assets in their Account Book. A part of it was the Debts of Farmers. You may recall, several small Banks went into Red immediately afterwards and the Government had paid a hefty amount to put them on track. And a part of this bad debt is being included in the waiver.
If we take out the Bad Debt, which in any way had already been written off, the net amount is quite manageable by the government.
And an analysis that ignores this fact, would never be a complete one. If the Government is to dole out such a huge amount, our entire economy will break down for sure.
So the hypothesis that analyzes as to what would happen if such a huge outlay is committed for a seemingly unproductive work, does not make any sense.
RE:Hypothesis
by All Right on Mar 19, 2008 06:12 AM Permalink
Why is the whole analysis a bad hypothesis?
If you read the article carefully, the 60,000 Cr. Farmer package is not even an issue at stake. The author is arguing about how Congress has set an election trap for the Left. The trap is set around the Nuclear Deal, not the Farmer package. IF the left withdraw their support because of the nuclear deal being inked, THEN Congress will play their Farmer card. Whether or not it would have created any dent in the economy is not even a point of discussion then.
Mr. All Right, I fully agree that the Congress has announced this to woo farmers that constitute directly or indirectly 70% of the entire population. But they have not targeted the Left. The Left would be non existant any more, anyway. Definitely, this waiver, once workedout fully, will go down well with these poor people, who actually VOTE.
And this Waiver Scheme has been worked out very carefully in all these years so that the impact would not be much on the economy.
There will surely be expectations in the non-farm poors that one day this government would elevate their condition as well. And that would surely be many more Crore Votes.
It is the 60 Crore VOTEs that count, and not the Nuclear Issue or anything else.
RE:Hypothesis
by peter pan on Mar 21, 2008 09:39 AM Permalink
We need to do much more than just Rs 60000 crores. It is a huge amount but is not enough to make much of an effect on the plight of the poor debt-ridden farmers. And 70% of our nation still depends on agriculture for livelihood. A lot needs to be done in the direction of reducing the economic disparity that exists in our nation if we are to reach anywhere near we intend to.
