RE::(
by on Mar 17, 2008 11:17 AM Permalink
I am not afraid of death. I just don't want to be there when it happens :)
On a serious tone, I believe Sarabjeet can be saved. Only if our government is a bit pragmatic. And takes the bold step of commuting the death sentence of Afzal, who has been sentenced without any direct evidence only to satisfy the "collective conscience of the society".
LOSING FACE
The noble art of losing face may one day save the human race and turn into eternal merit what weaker minds would call disgrace.
One feels Sarabjit is being made to pay the price for an unnecessary statement to the press by Kashmir Singh soon after his release. Where was the need for him to exhibit his misguided valour by claiming that he indeed was a spy, after crying hoarse that he wasn't one during 35 long years of incarceration. Even if he retracted the statement later, the harm had been done. For Pakistan, any show of clemency to Sarabjit would mean a severe loss of face after the Kashmir Singh imbroglio. It is a pity that a person who has been languishing in jail for 18 long years is now being awarded with death penalty. It is time for the powers-that-be to intercede and ensure that justice prevails on humanitarian grounds.
RE:Intercession is the need of the hour
by on Mar 17, 2008 10:52 AM Permalink
Dear Jay,
Don't be pessimistic. We can save Sarabjit. India must come forward by a positive gesture of commuting the death sentence of Afzal, who has been sentenced in the absence of any direct evidence and on the basis of very dubious circumstantial evidences.
The police say that they found explosives in Afzal's house when he was in custody, but cannot satisfactorily explain why they broke into it when the landlord had the key. This puts a question-mark over the evidence. The cellphone records were all traced to a Delhi number (98114-89429), used on an instrument allegedly found on Afzal when he was arrested in Srinagar. The instrument did not contain a SIM (Subscriber Idendity Module) card; it was identified through the IMEI (International Mobile Equipment Identity) number (which is unique to each instrument).
But how did the police discover the IMEI number? This can only be done in two ways: you either open the instrument and read the number; or you dial a code and it is displayed. But the policeman who made the recovery said on oath that he neither opened the instrument nor operated it. (Remarkably, Jammu and Kashmir did not have a cellular network in 2001.)
It is open to doubt whether Afzal actually had the cellphone that was so crucial to establishing that he was in contact with all five terrorists. In the absence of conclusive evidence that 98114-89429 belonged to and was used by Afzal, a deep, substantive conspiracy cannot be established.
RE:RE:Intercession is the need of the hour
by on Mar 17, 2008 10:54 AM Permalink
There is another grey area. The police produced a dealer who deposed that Afzal had bought the cellphone on December 14, with a new SIM card. But the police's own records show that the number was in use since November 6.
All this casts doubt on the circumstantial evidence, and warrants circumspection and caution in concluding that Afzal was involved in a deep conspiracy.
Equally significant is Afzal's personal deposition of how he was drawn into secessionist militancy and crossed over to "Azad Kashmir", but got disillusioned. As a surrendered militant, he was constantly harassed and subjected to extortion by the Special Task Force (STF). He claims that he was ordered by one Tariq, connected with the STF, to escort Mohammad to Delhi, and did so. This was never controverted.
The picture that emerges from the testimony is that of a person who does not readily lie and can be forthright to the point of incriminating himself. Minimally, this suggests that he is capable of acting in good faith and not beyond reform.
Because Afzal did not commit murder, the death sentence verdict turns pivotally on the "waging-war-against-the-state" charge. But such treason is marked by great ambiguity. The idea derives from the early medieval doctrine of lese majeste, which holds that any affront to the sovereign (the king, with his divine sanction), is always grave enough to deserve death.
RE:RE:RE:RE:Intercession is the need of the hour
by on Mar 17, 2008 10:57 AM Permalink
A secondary premise is that Parliament House is an embodiment of sovereignty - not just metaphorically or symbolically. Therefore, attacking it is tantamount to waging war on India. This is surely a literalist overreading. By this criterion, the members of the radical Dalit Panthers, who burned the Constitution in the 1970s, should have been hanged. Yet, the higher judiciary itself warned against such excess in 1951 - vis-a-vis the Bihar police mutiny, during which the rebels fired on the Army.
The inference that Afzal is guilty of waging war, murder and conspiracy is based on doubtful surmises. The element of doubt is so large that it would be unconscionable to extinguish a human life.
President Prathibha Patel must act to prevent such miscarriage of justice, in both sides of the border. She should unhesitatingly commute Afzal's sentence. She has every power to review and reappraise the case. It is her moral and Constitutional duty to apply humane criteria and ensure that misinterpretation of the law and anti-terrorist zeal do not result in death.
RE:RE:RE:Intercession is the need of the hour
by on Mar 17, 2008 10:56 AM Permalink
A secondary premise is that Parliament House is an embodiment of sovereignty - not just metaphorically or symbolically. Therefore, attacking it is tantamount to waging war on India. This is surely a literalist overreading. By this criterion, the members of the radical Dalit Panthers, who burned the Constitution in the 1970s, should have been hanged. Yet, the higher judiciary itself warned against such excess in 1951 - vis-a-vis the Bihar police mutiny, during which the rebels fired on the Army.
The inference that Afzal is guilty of waging war, murder and conspiracy is based on doubtful surmises. The element of doubt is so large that it would be unconscionable to extinguish a human life.
President Prathibha Patel must act to prevent such miscarriage of justice, in both sides of the border. She should unhesitatingly commute Afzal's sentence. She has every power to review and reappraise the case. It is her moral and Constitutional duty to apply humane criteria and ensure that misinterpretation of the law and anti-terrorist zeal do not result in death.
are bhai agar kisi ko kuch padi nahin hai usey latkane ki to tum kyon dukhi hote ho? us ne aisa koi bada pap thode hi kiya hai? sirf parliament ko hi to uda raha tha bichara... haan agar us mein do char neta log bhi mare gaye hote to alag baat thi. tab to wo ab tak swarg me menaka ka naach dekhata rehta! khair... aise hi chalega bete....hamara pehle se hi yeh dhoran raha hai, ahimsa paramo dharmah! koi apni mar ke gaya to bhi parwah nahin. pochh dalo, aur phir tel laga kar tayyar ho jao, dubara marwane ke liye... kitni bar marega, eh? akhir to thak jayega na? aise hi agli bar koi nafzal guru ayega aur uda dega parliament ko....phir ham kahenge..ye nahin chalega...ham bardasht nahin karenge....phir poch dalenge aur tel lagakar....samjhe na???
RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by on Mar 17, 2008 10:45 AM Permalink
Bhai Ashwini, Did you ever think who might have masterminded the attack on our PArliament? Even the supreme court couldn't answer this question and they sentenced Afzal to death only to satisfy the "collective conscience of the society".
Do you know how many billions of dollars of military hardware were bought by both India and Pakistan after the attack on our Parliament from Western mercenaries? In the same time thousands of farmers killed themselves due to insolvency. If we had made better use of the money, we could have save 1.5 lakh farmers who killed them in last one decade.
Did you ever think who gained due to this attack on our Parliament? For months before the attack on parliament, both the government and the police had been saying that parliament could be attacked. On December 12 2001, the then prime minister, AB Vajpayee, warned of an imminent attack. On December 13 it happened. Given that there was an "improved security drill", how did a car bomb packed with explosives enter the parliament complex?
Within days of the attack, the Special Cell of the Delhi police said it was a meticulously planned joint operation of Jaish-e-Mohammad and Lashkar-e-Taiba. They said the attack was led by a man called "Mohammad" who was also involved in the hijacking of flight IC-814 in 1998. (This was later refuted by the Central Bureau of Investigation.) None of this was ever proved in court. What evidence did the Special Cell have for its claim?
RE:RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by sah on Mar 17, 2008 11:05 AM Permalink
Ashwini mam aap hain board par ham ne afzal ko hang kar diya hain (sabdulhadi1983@rediffmail.com)
RE:RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by sah on Mar 17, 2008 11:05 AM Permalink
Ashwini mam aap hain board par ham ne afzal ko hang kar diya hain (sabdulhadi1983@rediffmail.com)
RE:RE:RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by ashwini ghadge on Mar 17, 2008 10:51 AM Permalink
sab se pehle, main MISS ASHWINI hoon. aur haan, main itna hi jaanti hoon ki afzal doshi hai aur us ko latka dena chahiye. it is proven beyond doubt that he had a hand in the attack. vajpayee to chhakka tha lekin mujhe lagta hai ki soniya-ji un se jyada mard hai.
RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by on Mar 17, 2008 11:09 AM Permalink
Ashwini,
I humbly apologize for the gender faux paus. Hope you understand it was not intentional.
I am curious to know what made you think that it has been proven beyond doubt that he had a hand in the attack. Even the Supreme Court couldn't find any direct evidence against him. The Court couldn't even identify the masterminds of the attack. The Court sentenced Afzal to death only to satisfy the "collective conscience of the nation". Hatred is something which comes to people naturally, it's LOVE which we need to teach people.
In Lisbon, where heretics were publicly burned, it sometimes happened that one of them, by particularly edifying recantation, would be granted a boon of being strangled before being put to into the flames. This would make the spectators so furious, that he authorities had a great difficulty preventing them from lynching the penitent and burning him on their own account. The spectacle of writhing torments of the victims was, in fact, one of the principal pleasures to which the populace looked forward to enliven a somewhat drab existence.
Don't you think it is grave that you want to hang Afzal only to cheer yourself up, just the way we do when we win a cricket match against Pakistan?
Think madam, think.
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so" - Bertrand Russell
RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by on Mar 17, 2008 10:46 AM Permalink
Bhai Ashwini, Did you ever think who might have masterminded the attack on our PArliament? Even the supreme court couldn't answer this question and they sentenced Afzal to death only to satisfy the "collective conscience of the society".
Do you know how many billions of dollars of military hardware were bought by both India and Pakistan after the attack on our Parliament from Western mercenaries? In the same time thousands of farmers killed themselves due to insolvency. If we had made better use of the money, we could have save 1.5 lakh farmers who killed them in last one decade.
Did you ever think who gained due to this attack on our Parliament? For months before the attack on parliament, both the government and the police had been saying that parliament could be attacked. On December 12 2001, the then prime minister, AB Vajpayee, warned of an imminent attack. On December 13 it happened. Given that there was an "improved security drill", how did a car bomb packed with explosives enter the parliament complex?
Within days of the attack, the Special Cell of the Delhi police said it was a meticulously planned joint operation of Jaish-e-Mohammad and Lashkar-e-Taiba. They said the attack was led by a man called "Mohammad" who was also involved in the hijacking of flight IC-814 in 1998. (This was later refuted by the Central Bureau of Investigation.) None of this was ever proved in court. What evidence did the Special Cell have for its claim?
RE:Sansad ki aisi taisi!
by ashwini ghadge on Mar 17, 2008 10:54 AM Permalink
kyon koi shaq hai kya, mere sex ke bare mein?? kya ladkiyan criticize nahin kar sakti???
It's like a drop of water in the ocean. These are only media to attract more people for immigration. The real situation is much graver where PhD holders are compelled to run butcher shops, doctors are driving cabs, and most of the Indians are surviving in hand to mouth situation. These selected candidates are the ones who have struggled a lot in the past. What the present generation immigrants are suffering? Agents who are doing the immigration jobs are being awarded by Canadian government without even giving a thought of welfare for these immigrants. Even they never forget to exploit our wealthy people on the name of liberal life styles, laws in favour of so many illegal acts which are not permitted in countries like India. Actually there is nothing. Not even bread & butter for themselves. Most of the Canadians are the descents of world's most primitive backwarded tribes & till now they practice paedophilia in their society. People immigrate to Canada with big hopes, emptying their bank accounts but at last return back highly frustrated. This is more with people who have some amount of self respect left with them. Others have however mentally prepared themselves for working as sweepers, butchers, drivers, news paper distributors etc. Billions of money are flowing into Canada in the name of immigration, higher studies & their most hopeless tribal education systems etc.It's ice covered deserted moor land with no natural resources. Never compare it with USA. In the past it was
RE:Fighting is not the solution.
by Chandra Kant on Mar 17, 2008 10:24 AM Permalink
I agree with you. Here in Canada they are just humiliating us in different ways. We never expected it before. Since 5 years I have been here. I'm an engineering graduate yet I had to complete 3 years diploma which is just equivalent to ITI in India. They don't recognize our degrees, not even out PhD. I have already spent one million in that. Even then I have been working in a butcher shop. Still we are surviving hand to mouth. My wife is working as a maid servant in a office. My all bank balance has almost finished and engulfed by those Canadian mafias. Canadians are encoded not to allow any Indians specially Hindus, to earn their livelihood and take money from here. It%u2019s really miserable. As we have no body to help us since everyone knows very well about our country, so we are being crushed in between. I appreciate you for your kind notification about this perilous country which is going to be a silent killer for middle class Indian Hindus. Actually it is a curse for all Indian Hindus in this era. It's pity to know that till our so called India government not at all aware about all these cold blooded poisonous snakes like "Canadian immigration%u201D. We should pass a bill for prohibition on sending money to Canada and also to arrest all those immigration agents with immediate effect or it'll be too late for us.
RE:Fighting is not the solution.
by Chandra Kant on Mar 17, 2008 10:24 AM Permalink
In the past it was a wasteland of USA, just like Siberia in Russia.
i am very much regreted regarding this news.in india it will not happend to those who are waiting to be hanged.shame on our coward politicians.only god can save him.let all of our indian brothers joined together in this crisis and prey the allmighty that nothing should happend to him.
ZINDAGI ME KABHI TO PRO-ACTIVE BANO!!! WE MUST HANG AFZAL GURU BEFORE THEY HANG SARABJEET. ANYHOW THEY ARE GOING TO HANG SARABJEET AND THERE SEEMS NO ESCAPE NOW. SO WHY NOT GIVE THOSE BASXXRDS ONE TIGHT RAP ON THEIR CHEEK!?!??? AS IT IS, AFZAL GURU'S HANGING IS LONG OVERDUE. WILL GOVT OF INDIA TELL US WHEN ARE THEY GONNA DO THIS OR ARE THEY EVER GONNA DO THIS??? BUNCH OF EUNUCHS....
