RE:Indian muslims
by Kabeer on Jul 29, 2008 12:45 AM Permalink
Dear Rehana,
1. The beauty of India is multiculturalism. How does Uniform Civil Code help?. Everyone has a choice to be governed by what he or she likes; they can always choose the faith they want to follow and a Muslim can be coverted to Hinduism and vice-versa. Why do you need a Uniform Civil Code when you have a free choice?
2. Had you followed Shariyat Law or even its equivalent Hindu law, you would not have had so many criminals going on raping sprees and murders. Even some of the old Hindu laws advocate amputation and was actually practised till the advent of English Jurisprudence.
A Rape is not inhuman; but chopping off a rapists genitals is inhuman according to all human rights activists.
3. Yes Muslims should hand over the terrorists who hide behind them; but before they do it can any Hindu put Modi to gallows?
4. Simple common sense. YOur nations population depends on how many children a woman bears. Even a muslim has four wives each woman bears usually not more than 2 children. i.e. Eight children for a family. Check if a Hindu woman bears less than 2 children. Even there for four women you have 8 children. How Muslims are increasing Nations population?
5. Fine! Abolish Minority Commission. Can you in the same breath advocate scrapping of SC/ST commission? When one need not be distinguished by the faith, why distinguish him or her by caste and benefit them on that basis? Leave Congress aside. Does the BJP has the guts to scrap SC/ST Commission?
RE:Indian muslims
by Ratnesh Sahay on Jul 29, 2008 03:50 AM Permalink
If this is the opinion reflected in an educated literate miuslim, think about the majority of them who are not educated. One cannot expect any better from the community and I don't see how people stop hating them.
RE:Indian muslims
by Rehana on Jul 29, 2008 12:58 AM Permalink
Kabeer
1. Multi culturism can still prevail if there is uniform civil code in India. It has nothing to do with code. Conversion can still be there.
2. Presently no hindu law advocates for amputation. But our muslim neighbor countries still follow it in the name of shariyat law. In India when it comes to take advantage muslims follow Indian laws but when it does not they backout in the name of Shariyat Laws. How do you say that rape is not inhuman? attacking the dignity of a woman is not inhuman? sorry Kabeer but it looks like that you are one of sadists, talibani type muslim.
3 If you remember gujrat riots were the reaction of what muslims did before. how come modi to be put to gallows?
4. Marrying only one woman will bore only two children. Muslims can equate hindus on the same terms. theny why marrying four? dont try to fool others.
5. I am with you on this issue. Be it congress or BJP they should, in the interests of country, should abolish all such commissions which set communities apart.
RE:RE:Indian muslims
by Kabeer on Jul 29, 2008 01:09 AM Permalink
Dear Rehana,
1. Where the absence of Uniform Civil Code hurting Hindus? If it is hurting it hurts Muslims and they dont have a problem. Why Hindus should have a problem that doesnt concern them?
2. Read Arthshastra written by Kautilya.
3. I didnt say Rape is not inhuman; I am saying what the so called human rights activists say. They are against chopping off genitals of rapists and public thrashing of criminals. Had it been practised those who see that happening would desist from such activities. Today no one fears.
4. Do you sincerely believe that Modi could not have stopped the genocide that went on in Gujarat? Hasnot he used it to meet his political ends?
Understand one thing very clearly!
Modi never saved any Hindu and never will.
He only killed innocent Muslims instead of capturing and punishing Godhra perpetrators.
Many a conscientous Hindus who witnessed the carnage in Gujarat before their eyes used to wake up in the middle of theirn sleeps in mid night unable to accept the carnage.
RE:Indian muslims
by bharat bhooshan on Jul 29, 2008 08:54 AM Permalink
First of all you have no idea of uniform civil code which envisages administering the same set of secular civil laws to govern different people belonging to different religions and regions. So no special privilages will be given for one cummunity. There's nothing wrong in having uniform civil codes.
India is not a theocracy. we can not have our constitutions based on any relegion so ethically four woman for one man is not right at all!. But congress changes the law just to appese minority which happened Shah bao case. Did any so called progressive muslim had any guts to oppose this same!?
There's no doubt that demography of india is changing. Commies are opening the gate for bangladeshi and giving them all rights which is big cause of worry.
finally you only accept there are 8 childern per man. Isn't is ridiculous?
Just open the door of your mind .. think .. you will get solution!
RE:Indian muslims
by Demo-crazy on Jul 29, 2008 12:55 AM Permalink
Kabeer, Many of your arguments are downright silly! Wake up, think before you post something.
Uniform civil code is not going to stop you practice your religion. It will only come into play in the matter of applicable law.
RE:Indian muslims
by Kabeer on Jul 29, 2008 12:59 AM Permalink
Dear Crazy,
Why do you think English Jurisprudence is better than your own laws?
Just check in how many rules and regulations the Govt that follows Englsih Jurisprudence says upon attaing 18 year a son is not a dependent but an unmarried daughter even she is 60 years of age is a dependent.
Ok. Dont follow Shariyat Law.
But what about your own Arthshastra? Even Kautilya advocated similar punishments in Arthshastra! And Arthshastra is universally acknowledged as one of the most comprehensive compilation of practices of good statecraft.
Why see black and white? i see many people in this forum blaming muslim. muslim are against this acts. how can we support the acts of terrorism, when we have been subjected to it and have been opposing for many years now.
RE:dont equate these action of terrorism with muslims
by Rehana on Jul 29, 2008 12:04 AM Permalink
muslims are being blamed bcos they dont come out, against terrorists, in favour of uniform civil code ( being Indians ), against those who declare war against our nation (afzal guru), and such things..
RE:dont equate these action of terrorism with muslims
by virtuality on Jul 29, 2008 01:00 AM Permalink
these guys are not indians, they are only lying low, till they can convert India to an Islamic nation. India for them is nothing more than an unfinished job.
When Pota was operational during NDA's time, some of the most audacious terrorist attacks took place - Parliament, Akshardhaam, Reghuram Mandir etc So attacks will take place, with or without such laws.
The problem is more deeper. An advisory warning will not help state governments. In Karnataka the Police came across evidence of a blast in Channapatna - 50 kms from Bangalore, a day earlier and recovered a car full of explosives. The State government did nothing. This despite a central government advisory to be on high alert - 3 days before the blast.
The Centre gave an advisory warning to Gujarat 3 days before the blast. Despite Bangalore blast, the State government did nothing. The Gujarat government instead commenting on the Bangalore blast boasted on TV that such terror strikes would not hit Gujarat.
Instead of mainstreaming disgruntled sections of society - Naxalites, Muslims etc, the BJP and Hindutva follwers isolate them further. As long as this happens, POTA or even a stronger law will not help.
The Gujarat government complain that Central warning was not actionable. OK. Now that the blast has taken place, can they crack the case and bring the terrorist to book. At least if they do that, there is some hope.
RE:Why Pota ?????
by Rakesh Nandakumar on Jul 29, 2008 01:28 AM Permalink
any idea what is an 'advisory warning'? intelligence agencies shouldnt say.. watch out.. they should know - when how and where, what is happening..
hey guys, we all heard enough of aamir khans, javed akhtar's and shabana aazmi's when there were riots in gujarat and muslims were killed.
ever heard them condemning these blasts? maybe after a few days, they will shed crocodile tears and show sympathy for victims. but are they really hurt now that hindus were killed? or are they afraid of condeming islamic terrorists? well guys, could be latter.
open up yr eyes. secularism doesnt mean pro islamic or pro catholic. hindus are the only source of developments of this country(exceptions are there is every religion, but i am talking on generalized terms) and no one should ignore interests of hindus.
one more thing.. manmohan singh ji, are u able to sleep well now? i didnt hear statement from you that u had sleepless nights because innocent hindus were killed.
RE:question to secularists
by GGG on Jul 29, 2008 12:46 AM Permalink
when state formulated a policy of secularism based on protection of right for small section on the cost of big one, then the state admn need to shed tears for big group even though the bigger groups are subject to discrimination
Don't worry all the seculars(?) are now taking a very sound and enjoyable sleep
RE:question to secularists
by Rehana on Jul 29, 2008 12:06 AM Permalink
I never heard them saying against what is happening in Kashmir. I even never heard them saying anything about the displaced Kashmiri hindus.
Are they really secular? or real human rights activists?
After Ajmer, now comes Bangalore - both states ruled by BJP. Before that Akshardhaam - Gujarat, another state ruled by BJP. Even Modi could not stop terror. When the BJP led NDA ruled, the terrorist even had the audacity to attack parliament!
One has to be an idiot to buy BJP's slogan
Though links have been drawn between Bangalore and Ahmedabad blasts, the difference is also appreciated. In Bangalore, it looks as if it was a retailation. BJP goons celebrating their party in power, threw pork into a mosque, leading to communal tension. The government looked the other way naturally as their own goons were involved. So the Muslims took the terror route to warn the govt not to mess with them. Their intention was to warn not to destruct.
Gujarat was apparently different. This was a reaction to Godhra and Modi. No CM of any state except madman Modi challenges Terrorists to strike his state. Now they did and also made a point to maximally destroy Modis own constituency. So toll in Bangalore and Ahmedabad tell their own story. Bangalore 1, Ahmedabad 50
Modi remains the only CM in India's entire History to challenge terrorists to attack a state (Gujarat). This madman, Gujus try to sell to the rest of the country as PM material. Gujus have only themselves to blame for electing this madman
RE:If Modi was PM, He Will Challenge Pakistan to Nuke India
by Calspadeaspade on Jul 29, 2008 12:41 AM Permalink
There comes another cheer leader for the Islamic terrorists. If throwing pork at mask can provoke bomb blast you should not be complainig about the carnage in GUjarath. Muslims have done lot worse things.
What if Hindus boycott them as a community? What if Hindus force politicians to sit and take note of their anger by dictating terms like we will not tolerate Haj Subsidy, minority reservation, different laws for different communities? What if Hindus dictate that article 370 be repealed and Kashmir be made a state on par with any other state of India?
We all want a life of peace, dignity, equality, and fair chance. Any reservation be on economic criteria rather than caste, religion.
Any politician who does not support this view should be defeated. What do you think will be their response?
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by aoneall on Jul 28, 2008 11:40 PM Permalink
You are spewing venom against Muslims, OBC, SC, ST. What do you think you are? The fact is that upper castes are hardly 15 % and they have problem with rest of the population. Why not evey body boycots you and your upper caste fellows?
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by Demo-crazy on Jul 28, 2008 11:56 PM Permalink
Why do you bring in OBC, SC, ST in to this debate? They are Hindus first.
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by farid patel on Jul 28, 2008 11:57 PM Permalink
muslims dont sympathize with terrorism. we oppose it. dont equate action of few with faith of millions of people. get this through your thick skull, muslim are against killing of innocent. how can we support something, which we have been subjected to for many years.
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by Demo-crazy on Jul 29, 2008 12:10 AM Permalink
if you know history you will not speak like this. if you oppose it, why not help the police to catch them? how can such actions of committed group of individuals not be noticed in the community? there are many silent sympathisers and supporters, while shedding crocodile tears and repeating the line that it is a religion of peace. we know what the followers of this religion of peace are doing in afghanistan, pakistan, etc. what they did in USA, UK, Spain, etc is also too well known. why mislead people with the wording that this is a religion of peace? why not do something proactive to stop these terrorist elements, why not kick their promoters on the otherside of the border? we know what happened in godhra, in mumbai, in varanasi, in ayodhya, in hyderabad, in jaipur, etc. what proof you want? the followers are claiming their jihadi acts. why do you guys take shelter under some verses while they have hijacked the religon?
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by bharat bhooshan on Jul 29, 2008 09:04 AM Permalink
All those who executed recent blasts might be enjoying Biryanai on indian soil! If peopole like you were majority , they would have been nabbed by now!
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by rahul avasthi on Jul 29, 2008 12:10 AM Permalink
farid patel, i think u responded to point raised by demo crazy. ok, maybe you are correct that all muslims do not sympathize with terrorism. but isnt it a joke when u said that muslims were victim of terrorism for many years? i dont recall any such situation atleast in india. get your facts corrected first and join us in condemning the acts of terrorism
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by Sunil Jacob on Jul 29, 2008 12:13 AM Permalink
Educated people debating religions, castes and tribes.... Feels good to hear, it seems the future of this country is secure. God save this country !!!
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by sunaina hameed on Jul 29, 2008 12:29 AM Permalink
THANK YOU! YOURS IS THE ONLY COMMENT HERE THAT MAKES SENSE! WELL-SAID!
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by Demo-crazy on Jul 29, 2008 12:41 AM Permalink
@Sunaina, There are very few choices in life. No one wants to see a life cut short brutally by a terrorist act. We want peaceful life, life of dignity and equality.
Not a situation of being at the receiving end of violent ways followed by a group (however big or small it may be) which wants to achieve its objective or square up for perceived injustice. The whole point is about fighting terrorism, about countering the support system that they either command (out of respect or fear), etc.
This dirty war is now at the doorstep of even a commoner like you and me. We do not have the luxury of SPG guards to save us from potential attackers. Thinking that this is not something we need to be worried about, is a ostrich attitude.
RE:RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by Demo-crazy on Jul 29, 2008 12:17 AM Permalink
@Sunil Jacob,
Do you know what an ostrich does when it is being hunted? I hope you understand. When you have cancer you fight it with all the might at your command. Not wait for it to eat you.
We want peace, not piece.
When they bomb next, and if you or your near ones are at the receiving end, what do you do? Will you still react in this manner? Grow up brother.
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by virtuality on Jul 28, 2008 11:36 PM Permalink
Islamic ideology the quran gives conflicting views. It is the "hadeeth" is what determines Islamic behavior Islam views the world in two ways: dar-ul-islam (land of islam) when muslims are in power, anybody non muslim is a kafir, chuck them out. As in pakistan, or Kashmir, 500,000 chucked out since 1989. dar-ul-harab (Abode of war) when muslims are in minority, empowered by "sira" and "hadith", which says do anything unethical but try to come to power. Terrorism is part of the philosophy of dar-ul-harab. Terrorism is their religion
Only exception, when they have a fear of extermination, they form an alliance with the majority and that is what Mohammad did with the jews before he went to medina, as muslims do in USA and China.
But my complaint is not against Muslims. They have a clear mind. A clear strategy. It is the hindu who is confused.
The conclusion is clear. Until and unless Muslims live in fear of extermination, India will be their dar-ul-harab, and they will keep bombing in the name of Allah.
RE:RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by farid patel on Jul 28, 2008 11:58 PM Permalink
virtuality, stop spreading your lies. islam oppose killing of innocent this is a fundamental moral principle of islam
RE:RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by Demo-crazy on Jul 29, 2008 12:13 AM Permalink
It is an idea one should seriously think.
But it would be good if really the people think that violence is not the way to live life. We need people committed to this land, who love this country and its people, not those who love to kill their countrymen in cold blood. If anyone does not feel this is his homeland, they why live here? Unfortunately it is a tough question, but one may be forced to ask and answer.
RE:The terrorists and their sympathisers should think...
by rahul avasthi on Jul 28, 2008 11:51 PM Permalink
hey guys, we all heard enough of aamir khans, javed akhtar's and shabana aazmi's when there were riots in gujarat and muslims were killed.
ever heard them condemning these blasts? maybe after a few days, they will shed crocodile tears and show sympathy for victims. but are they really hurt now that hindus were killed? or are they afraid of condeming islamic terrorists? well guys, could be latter.
open up yr eyes. secularism doesnt mean pro islamic or pro catholic. hindus are the only source of developments of this country(exceptions are there is every religion, but i am talking on generalized terms) and no one should ignore interests of hindus.
one more thing.. manmohan singh ji, are u able to sleep well now? i didnt hear statement from you that u had sleepless nights because innocent hindus were killed.
RE:Large number of Gujarathi Muslims are involved
by BHuddha on Jul 28, 2008 11:23 PM Permalink
If you think ISLAM is a religion SIMILAR to 1000s of other religion then good luck to you and please ignore me.
But if you think there might be a very good possibility that ISLAM might be responsible for how muslims think and ACT, then you might want to know more about ISLAM. And we all know that these terrorist are very religious, don’t we?
If you think the terrorist are your enemies, then you might want to follow Sun Tzu's advice and know your enemies.
A good start will be to hear from an ex muslim, who knows ISLAM inside out.
Please google AliSina or faith freedom and find out for yourself.
RE:Large number of Gujarathi Muslims are involved
by aoneall on Jul 28, 2008 11:43 PM Permalink
Cowards like you and your leader Modi act brave when they are in power. Do you think Modi is a brave man because he misused his position to kill innocent civilians?
RE:Large number of Gujarathi Muslims are involved
by Demo-crazy on Jul 29, 2008 12:24 AM Permalink
ever thought why the people reacted in that manner? ever thought if the sabarmati coach had not been burnt, the repurcussions may not have happened?
no doubt the 2002 riots were bad, horrible, and wrong. but why you folks remain conveniently silent on the worst kind of mayhem caused by the other side?
