I think building systems on your own is a great idea but at the same time there is a fine line between what we would like to build and what we can actually build. The bottom line is that Civilians should not dicticate to the armed forces as to what they should buy.They are the end users and thus are the best people to decide what they want. Thats how its done in most developed nations. The Gov job is to provide fund and make sure no bribes or illegal activities have taken place in the contract. My opinion about DRDO is that in the name of nationalism we are forcing our armed forces to use junk or in many cases forcing them to delay buying new weapons like fighter jets due to the fact DRDO has been promising LCA for the last 20 years ! No wonder we have a problem today in the IAF that they have few modern aircrafts and in desperation have upgraded an aging Mig 21.
The best solution for India is to have DRDO find international partners. Every thing in a global economy is done with colobrations. US too has many defense colobarations with nations in the EU and Israel. So should India. If DRDO fails to produce a system in a given time frame then the armed forces should not be held on ransom, they should be given the green light to buy from international vendors.
We need more competition in the defense market. Have more Indian companies compete with DRDO. In that way DRDO will not take things for granted.
RE:DRDO
by jagadisan krishnamoorthy on Jan 17, 2008 10:43 PM Permalink
it is very difficult to find international partners,in a position of weakness. Even for this we have to prove our merit and become worthy of partnership at equal footing, else we would be dummy partners or just receiving partners. Today DRDO can proudly say that we have the technological prowess where, giants like Russia(BRAHMOS) or Isreal do not hesitate to work with us with quaal partnership. Infact we have 51% partnership stake in BRAHMOS. It is DRDO which has made us proud, inspite of spiralling attrition problems in the wake of software boom etc. and inspite of the meagre salary that Govt. pays to the poor dedicated scientists.
RE:DRDO
by commander hans on Jan 18, 2008 08:16 PM Permalink
moorthy sir it seems you are talking without any knowledge of the industry...do you know foreign partners want to come in but duffers in drdo dont want them to come in, because then their monopoly will be removed and they will have to run like a profitable org which is clear from the past performance that they are incapable of doing..
SO much is being talked abt, much of it only hot air. SOme are calling armed forces corrupt without even thinking twice. Yes, they are also part of society and some effects are bound to appear but making a sweeping statement? Irresponsible. A Aremd force officer takes 18-20 yesra to become colonel and a DRDO man 12 years to become scientist E and 16 to Become Scientist F which draw a shed lower and higher salary as colonel, without any accountibility. A small mistake and a colonel or even a lieutenat would be court marshalled and thrown out, what about so many failures. Remember Telhaka, all military men are dismissed post court martials, nothing has happened to civilians. I think military is short charged by all including DRdo. Their salaries are same as govt servants but is there a comparision in their working conditions? Nation wants a jawan to dia for 4000 Rs a month on frozen peaks while everyone in govet in general would be making money and to top it (add insultto injury), some call same military men corrupt as acommunity. There is enough Patriotism in armed forces to have pride in Indian made things. Why are they not complaining of tata and ashok leyland trucks or ordinance factory products.
As for DRDO, I think the auther is speaking truth and only truth, though may be exaggerated for generating appropriate impact.
RE:Rationality Given Go By
by Gurudeep Bala on Jan 16, 2008 11:53 PM Permalink
The author has hit the hammer on the nail head! But one must understand how things work in India. If i had to put it in one line then i'd say, "BEER BUDGETS, CHAMPAGNE DREAMS". Thats what we are. We want the product, but are not ready to spend. The drop out rate of scientists from DRDO is phenomenonally high because there is not enough pay. By the time a scientist is half way through his project, greener pastures lure him away. As for the complaints by armed forces of sub-standard products, do not be fooled, its their life and the life of the men they command at risk - surely they do complain as is evident by the numerous press relaeases and tv interviews that pop up, but under pressure from the DRDO lobby the government forces the armed force personnel to accept the sub-standard equipment. Poor Army, Navy and Air Force. I really pity them. Putting their life at stake to protect us (& the DRDO personnel) with equipments that may never give them any edge over the enemy. But the trend seems to be changing slowly with the Armed Force senior officers now more vocal voicing their concerns about quality related issues openly - they better do if they want to win a war.
RE:Rationality Given Go By
by ratan kumar on Jan 17, 2008 12:25 AM Permalink
Dear Bharat verma What do you mean by saying that DRDO is spending its budget on world-class hostels and not on research? Do you have account of those expenses. If you have...dare to make it public. Being a editer you should not make such a general statement. Blaming DRDO for "wrongly assumed fact the india is having inferior weapon to pakistan" doesnot make sense, as armed forces are always going to buy the required weapons. Lockheed martin and boeing are not going outside for a collaboration without having basic infrastructures. I do accept the there were delay in delivering products by DRDO, but it has developed many basic infrastructure for future development. Telling all bad about DRDO will infact discourage DRDO scientists and engineers. Do you know the salary and incentives of a common engineer outside. And you cant expect a competitive talent to work in DRDo for poor salary. Have you ever tried to highlight the fact that in recent years thousands have engineers left DRDo because of poor incentives.
RE:Rationality Given Go By
by commander hans on Jan 18, 2008 08:18 PM Permalink
ratan do you want your countrymen in the army to use substandard materials and items...by bashing the writer ans not saying anything about the org..it seems that is what you want...so who is the culprit here..
RE:Rationality Given Go By
by Vijay Vijay on Jan 21, 2008 02:32 PM Permalink
Well, without calling names and getting emotional, if we consider both sides of the case, we can easily see that the need of the hour is MORE ACCOUNTABILITY from DRDO. Plus, on-par salaries for the scientists. (Then, if Govt. starts saying "Oh, by the way, then,we may need to INCREASE salaries for EVERYBODY in Govt. service, etc., then it means political will lacking in the Govt. That's all). Definitely we can't let foreign firms dictate to us, and we can't let our Defence Forces get decimated with sub-standard equipment. Both are bad in the long run. Better Govt. wakes up to the reality and takes these corrective measures.
DRDO is full of reservation quota scientists. I tried to look for an opening in DRDO and other govt. organization, but all openings are for reserved catogories. SC, ST, OBC. I am higly qualified scientist, but no opening for me in Indian Govt jobs. So left for abroad. There is hardly any R and D in private sector. Only some research and development occurs in software industry in India. Applied sciences research is a big zero. Here are some facts why India fails to develop any new technlogy, India has 157 researchers/million people, while US has over 5000 researchers /million, Sweden and Finland over 7000 researchers /million and China about 800 researcher /million. Govt. and private sector spends very very little on research.So how will they get new technology. I love my country and would love to come back if I get a decent research job. But thanks to reservation and govt. apathy many highly trained scientists are working abroad. I am sure many people will start abusing me for having left my country and being a Brahmin elitist. They are welcome to do it as they dont want to look at the reality.
RE:DRDO and reservation
by Attatar Yena on Jan 16, 2008 11:35 PM Permalink
One thing is for sure that India needs to invest more in R&D considering the its size and its problems. Also India needs to create more world class institutions in all relevant fields. This will not only enable people with aspirations to do R&D work to stay back in India but will also do away with the feeling that the 'cake' is too small for everybody to share and be happy. We need to create more opportunities. The current requirement for scientists in India definitly does not reflect our population ( most of the research and teaching posts are based proportionately on 1960 Population Census) and its complex needs. It is high time the MPs in Parliaments and ministers stop spending lavilshly on their perks and invest in creating world class instituions. The amount of money wasted because of frequent adjournments of Upper and Lower houses of Parliament could easily fund a research institution but who cares...It is all about creating more opportunities per head.
RE:DRDO and reservation
by pavani on Jan 17, 2008 02:35 AM Permalink
Hey.. I am a brahmin girl. Graduated from IITKanpur...But I worked with DRDO as scientist for 2 yrs.. as soon as I came out from college. I have also posted a message like Schedule of scientist.... I am also in abroad now. I was not given chance to work completely.
RE:DRDO and reservation
by jagadisan krishnamoorthy on Jan 17, 2008 10:48 PM Permalink
Dear Pavani, ask not what the country can give you, please ask what you can give the country. IIT graduates who have left the country for better prospects have no right to talk about DRDO, where the great achievements are being made just with second grade engineers, but sincere, dedicated and patriotic.
RE:Bharat Varma is piad by all West's defece suppliers
by dev ghosh on Jan 17, 2008 12:48 PM Permalink
Hey Let those pakis make their missiles with the help of other countries like china.DRDO's policy to make indigenous arms and missiles is the best policy.AT LEAST WE ARE STANDING OR TRYING TO STAND ON OUR OWN FEET NOT ON OTHERS.Instead of shutting DRDO make it more suitable and better equipped.Convince more young scientists to join it by increasing salary and better opportunities .Allocate more money from our defense budget for DRDO.Then Mr.Verma u will see how stupid u r.
RE:Bharat Varma is piad by all West's defece suppliers
by commander hans on Jan 18, 2008 08:21 PM Permalink
dinesh jain....get your facts correct...do you know even know what you are talking about...wow...u are really something...just the urge to type something makes you type something as silly as that....
Quite sometime back I had a lively chat with some guy who was hell-bent on selling me the greatnes of Indian engineering ingenuity. My point is simple, we hear of some notch brain like Kalam, Arunachalam, Nair linked to Space, misile and other programmes. The governmen's thinking is hopelessly linear about his issue. We are overly dependent on Academic geniuses who however are yet to put to test the practical applications of all their theories. But these high-brain are sufficiently able to conveince the politicios with their high pitch talks to continue some or the other dud programmes. Indian Army alone is not to be blamed. There is too much of beuracratic policying about the entire sphere of defence preparedness. India is on a shaky ground.
RE:Timely pointer
by ritu on Jan 16, 2008 07:43 PM Permalink
Re: Its quite easy pointing fingers. Get into it and Prove. Why all these people who are criticising government etc etc come and join in?? How many people who critise Policemen actually join police force? Same applies here too. Where are the so called IITians, NITians, IISc pass outs?? Pursuing their MS and Phds in US universities?
RE:Timely pointer
by mindgod on Jan 19, 2008 01:48 PM Permalink
Hmm One IIT who stayed back for Golden Quadrilateral super highway project got killed. And no one from the top who master-minded and leaked his letter to PMO is arrested..!!!
Another IIM bechara from ONGC got killed for exposing top level adulteration of petrol.
What are u suggesting ritu. A damaged system can be corrected only after a collapse. May be after another division.
