I feel everyone should respect the faith of 100 crore people, if hindus believe and have sculptures to prove that Ram and his miracles existed then others should respect it. Few Idiots try to take advantage of peoples sentiments by asking for proof. Faith is not dependent on NASA or National Geographic to prove whether it is a coral reef or a made man bridge, If it is built by Ram and his army so is it.
Can anyone who claims to be educated and has all scientific proof to prove that he has seen the OXYGEN that he or she inhails? NO that means that all these intelligent people can be alive without oxygen. Let us take a morcha and teach all doctors and scientists that oxygen is a myth.
Keep your religion to yourself and that is the best way to be faithful, rather then bringing religion on roads and Nukkads or doing Jihad in the name of religion.
I feel atleast all politicians should stop making remarks about religion. And all religious leader should refrain from making comments about other religion.
Following the above 2 suggestion I believe NO COMMON PERSON WILL HAVE TIME TO FIGHT ABOUT ALLAH OR JESUS OR RAM OR GURU NANAK. We will be happy to practise our religion within our homes and temples, Mosque, and Church.
RE:RE:Politics Religion and Progress
by Indian Muslim on Sep 26, 2007 12:21 AM Permalink
Do not try to quote part of a verse from Quran, You are a muslim hiding in a hindus name.
First practise your religion before you comment on others.
Learn Sura Al-kafiroon you will understand what your religion says
RE:dinesh
by dinesh kumar on Sep 26, 2007 12:05 AM Permalink
patil,i will accept ur theory that shambuka was a latter day adition as im not a scholar of the ramayana.
i remember reading when i was young,i dont know which version it was.
it had the sanskrit verse followed by an english translation.
are u sure that it was a latter day addition,seshadri also tells so.
RE:dinesh
by Seshadri on Sep 26, 2007 12:13 AM Permalink
Dinesh, I am answering to your query on Vali here since the other thread is too long...
My opinion does not matter... Those are circumstantial where explanations are given by Lord Rama, to uphold Dharma...
Anyway, what has that got to do with the political drama that DMK have staged... my intention is not to discuss Ramayana in this forum... It is only that people see through the flimsy veil of hypocrisy in which the DMK have cloaked themselves...
RE:RE:dinesh
by r patil on Sep 26, 2007 12:30 AM Permalink
Dineshji I dont know that,thay are many versions of ramayan and i dont know who wrote them.Valmiki has only written till rama returns back to ayadha it is said that even utter ramayan is not written by him.I had never heard of that story before nor did my parents and grand parents who told us about this pecular story and I bet majority of the hindus dont know this story.The funny thing is this dalit site which is maintained by christains when we point to them about the existance and preferance of slavery in bible,they shout line taken out of context.When it is very clear their are so many innumeral referances to slavery in bible and not one and not one i repeat comdemed slavery, infact most of the verses support slavery.
So dear dinesh you tell us is this story of shambuk consistance to all the other examples?
Lets says if Ram did what he did and did it with a very clear consience and proud about it,then their should be many many more such incidents and not just one,as it is consistance with ramayan that rama killed in fact many demons(i dont know which cast)so their must be many similar examples too.By the way do you know Ram has praised hanuman for his command over sanskit and knowledge of vedas even though hanuman belonged to tribals .
RE:dinesh
by r patil on Sep 26, 2007 12:15 AM Permalink
Dinesh and others who believe in that Shambuk story tell us what other incidents you can find in Valmiki's RAmayan where untouchability is followed ,if you cannot then it means it is out of context and this story is surely a later day addition when "untouchability was at its peak".
For all those who beleive that harappa culture was an tamil culture asnwer this.
1.Firugering having arm bangles are very similar to the arm bangals worn by rajasthani women .If it was a tamil practise why the tradition following tamils abundant it,and why did the later day arrivals took up the tradition.
2.figgarings with sindoor in parted hair is found in harappa again which is typical north indian custom and not a south indian one as putting bindi is a south indian custom.
3.the houses of harappa are build with bricks and have flat roof very similar to typical north indian old village houses even now not like south indian old houses build with stones.
4.the main staple food is barley and wheat and rice is hardly their ,again a very typical north indian custom whereas south indian are rice eaters only recetly few have stared eating
wheat.
5.The DNA samples found in the seletons of harappa and mohanjodaro is similar to the dna sample from people living in that near by area even now and not to the south indian or say tamilians.
6.furter more their are no temples only vedic altars.
For more thoerough details must read keonaraad elst on aryan dravidian origin.
RE:RE:RE:dinesh
by r patil on Sep 26, 2007 12:36 AM Permalink
Ofcourse their was a difference in worship early not now since now whole of Indian beleives are mixed you so much that it is hard to seperate any thing out of it.if rama and krishna was the god only of north indian then
why south india and the south east asian even the indonesian muslim worship Ram ?
IF siva was only a south indian god why so many north indians kuladevata is siva including the svaities kashmiri pandits?
RE:To WhatsUP
by Seshadri on Sep 25, 2007 11:55 PM Permalink
Since God can be anything, the elemental forces of nature are considered manifestations of God and worshipped...
There are many other valid answers to your query, but since your post seems only to criticise and not to seek, I refrain from further comments...
RE:To WhatsUP
by derc cruse on Sep 25, 2007 11:53 PM Permalink
The basic concept is God can by anything as He does not have bias (like he does not have to come in white man's form).
RE:To WhatsUP
by Al-lat the moon God on Sep 26, 2007 12:15 AM Permalink
I know whats happening here: 1. Worshipping trees or monkey men - plain wrong 2. Worshipping some person born 2000 years ago (and one who was born of a virgin! my what a miracle) - Logical 3. Worshipping a God whose prophet travelled all the way to heaven on a donkey along with Archangel Gabriel (which is perfectly logical and not a figment of his imagination) - The supreme truth.
RE:To WhatsUP
by derc cruse on Sep 26, 2007 12:01 AM Permalink
Why should I seek? I know what is God, I mean understand the concept. I criticize who criticize our belief
I know this is an emotional subject but that does not mean we become animals.
Religion is a belief and nearly impossible to prove it in court. This applies to Hindus, Muslims, Jews, Christians etc.
People have the right to worship anyone they want and they have a right to have a belief or they can be atheist. That is guaranteed under the Constitution of India/Bharat.
The RAM Sethu is a National/State Property. The use of which will be decided by the Central and the state Government. Their decision can be challenged in the court.
People are comparing the Ram Sethu with Mecca and Medina. Fair Comparison. Both are places of worship and have religious significance to their respective believers/followers.
But the difference is that Mecca and Medina are administered by Muslim Governments and these places are dedicated by the government for religious purposes.
Now, if some Muslim in Spain claims a private/public property based on his religious beliefs, then he has to prove his belief in the court of the Land. That is the key difference.
If the Central/State government decide to make Ram Sethu a monument, fine with me. But this needs to be done in a correct way.
India is NOT a HINDU country and the belief of Ram's existence is NOT shared by all. Hence there will be legal issues.
Start thinking along these lines. Being emotional and ranting will not help your cause or the Nation.
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by ChalapathiRao Mudigonda on Sep 26, 2007 12:48 AM Permalink
To Sri.Imran patel-You spoke wise and right, but we wish that your understanding of the term "Hindu" should be broader.The term "Hindu" is a historical derivative or corrupted form of the word "Sindhu". Those who inhabited Sindhu pranth are "Sindhis" which as the time went on, came to be known as "Hindis or Hindus". So there is nothing wrong or religious, when we all- Hindus,Muslims, Parsis, christians, Sikhs,Budhists etc, are called Hindus which mean Indians. that is why, when our great patriot, Subhash Chandra Bose coined the word "Jai Hind" and our first Prime Minister,jawaharlal Nehru adopted and repeated it in the public meetings, none took objection. On the other hand the people felt proud and emotional to utter it as sacred and patriotic word. it is narrow to understand it as a word denoting or belonging to a particular religion. Let us be proud to call ourselves as "Hindus" that is, "Indians". History knows and states our land as Hindustan. let us be wise and enlightened to accept this fact and Truth.Then many problems ailing India and its Sisters Pakistan and Bangladesh will disappear. regarding belief in Ram sethu, it should not be treated as neither Hindu nor Muslim nor Christian nor Atheist. It is a National sentiment and monument like Taj Mahal, Golden Temple, Budha Gaya, Periyar Mandir in Chennai, Ambedkar statue any where, Tipus tomb, to quote a few. Let us respect each other; that's all;
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by Polisetty Ravishankar on Sep 25, 2007 11:59 PM Permalink
gGood logic Imran. If we had put the same into our country's development instead of spreading terrorism then the world wold have been a better place. And actually thanks to you - You have mentioned an important point - You only wanted that INDIA needs to be renamed as a Hindu country. OK. Good suggestion. I will work towards that.
RE:RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by imran patel on Sep 26, 2007 12:09 AM Permalink
If the Indian government is OK with having Ram Sethu as a National Heritage and wants to preserve it, I will respect that decision.
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by SSK KSS on Sep 26, 2007 12:04 AM Permalink
Dear Muslim friend, please listen. By the name itself, it is called Ram Sethu. Not India sethu or government Sethu. The sentiment is attached to the very name and it cannot be destroyed by any court because People's sentiments are respected and guaranteed by the constitution. Governments come and go and are ruled by few people who impose their personal views and we are against those handful of people. BTW, Who are you to ask us to think in your lines of stupid thought?
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by derc cruse on Sep 25, 2007 11:56 PM Permalink
Good reason. Will you let destroy Jama MAsjid with the same theory or let build a railway over cemetary if needed? Ram Setu is historical heritage-without experimenting it cannot destroyed just like we do not destroy the above things.
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by imran patel on Sep 26, 2007 12:07 AM Permalink
Der Cruse, If a Project comes up that requires the Jama Masjid to be destroyed, then the ONLY option is for the government to buy the land on which Jama Masjid.
Jama Masjid is not Owned by the government. This also involves property rights. If Muslims say that there was a MOSQUE at someone residence before, they cannot just take away that Land. The only option they have is to buy that land from its current owner. And you cannot force that person to sell his/her land your the Mosque.
It his is right to own that property. That right needs to be protected by the Govt.
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by Sarath Chandra on Sep 26, 2007 12:00 AM Permalink
The problem with arguments like yours is that, Hindus will want to make India a Hindu country, officially. This is because as you said there is inherent "advantage" in being governed by "muslim governement". The world over only Muslim majority countries are "Muslim governments". There are virutally no christian or hindu governments in the world. Why cannot Islam do the same; separate governance and religion?
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by h h on Sep 25, 2007 11:59 PM Permalink
Imran ..i see ur point ..If you say india is not a hindu country its not a muslim country ..In tha case would the muslims accept the judiciary system of india instead of theri "Talaaq Tallaq" ...No right ....What if governement says all the mosques should have prayers insisde teh mosque without loud speakers and shouldnt shout like mad dogs in the evening which is disturbing the people outside .So start thinking as an indian and tell would muslims accept such rules...
RE:RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by imran patel on Sep 26, 2007 12:11 AM Permalink
I am in favor of common civil code. If Muslims want to follow Islamic LAW, then they need to do it within their community without Government supervision. I do not want government money to be spent on Muslims having a different set of LAWS from the common civil Laws
RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by Hariom Rai on Sep 26, 2007 12:00 AM Permalink
everything that muslim does is right and we cannot express our views , ur fellow muslims protest on trivial issues they make a riot out of a saddam issue who is not in anyways related to india,and trying to give philosophy about rationality,no law is above ur shariat but we shld follow all laws and shld respect all religions feelings wow what a secular comment!
RE:RE:Hindu Friends...Please Listen.
by imran patel on Sep 26, 2007 12:12 AM Permalink
I have never supported actions of Muslims that you menation. I am infact critical of these actions.
RE:Togadia should be in prison
by sathish ganapathy on Sep 25, 2007 11:38 PM Permalink
So that u and me can post messages and rediff can increase their hits to their site!
RE:Togadia should be in prison
by John. P. Patrick on Sep 25, 2007 11:58 PM Permalink
One thing not to forget, why the Hell Rediff.com has not taken the Fatwa issue up to him???, while they were remembered abt Karunanidhi's Comments.
Rediff and for that matter the whole bunch of head less chickens the so called media, wanted to push and pour fuel to this controversy and build the flame, where you and me will finally die.
Just for your to think. When Babar Masjid & Ram Mandhir has controversy in same place, without any common settlement, destructing the masjid to build temple... is this fair... Patriotic, Secular, Democratic?... Now wanted to run the same stuff in Ram Sethu...
NDA has not approved the project. my foot. Why did they even think of it in the first place. All I can clearly say is BJP learn a lesson to keep Hinduthuva behind(hidden), focus politics, while VHP/RSS would do the so called movements...
Sure can assure you one thing. till Karunanidhi is there, no movements is gonna happen. Lets see how many dared politicians hit TN on this movement to really do something aggressively like the Ramjanmaboomi episode to happen again.
RE:Patriotic movement
by sathish ganapathy on Sep 25, 2007 11:35 PM Permalink
They killed many people in the name of Hindusim and helped India control population! Wat else u expect from these stupids?
RE:Patriotic movement
by amit kalaskar on Sep 25, 2007 11:46 PM Permalink
Bhailogo there are lot of thingz which is important to this nation..Why dont we talk about increasing productivity in terms of agriculture, service & Industry...
RE:Patriotic movement
by Vishal Gandhe on Sep 25, 2007 11:52 PM Permalink
I am still not sure what benifit Govenment is looking from Ram Sethu Project. Looking at the minimal export we do to Sri Lankan subcontinent, I belive the prime beneficiary for this project will be Sri Lanka as it will drastically redue their transportation cost fot export trade with India and second prime beneficiary will be LTTE as it will create an easy way for them to escape to India from Sri Lankan borders. If you really looking at the benifit for India, then the best issue is N-Deal with US whicch our govt is movving back under the let pressure not this stupid project.
RE:Patriotic movement
by sathish ganapathy on Sep 25, 2007 11:57 PM Permalink
Most of the ships from west to east now dock in Lanka will use tuticorin instead if Sethu Samuthram is built. That will boost trades in South India and fyi LTTE r too good no matter wat u do, they will or will not come to India if they wish.
RE:Patriotic movement
by Only Dude on Sep 26, 2007 12:36 AM Permalink
BULLSHIT! The profits we get are minimal because large ships cant pass theu this channel even after drilling - its jsut plain politics
RE:Patriotic movement
by Amitabh Kumar on Sep 25, 2007 11:42 PM Permalink
In todays world neither any Mulim nor any Hindu religious party exists which is not influenced by the politics. If you really have the faith in your words then either you are one of leaders of such party or just a stupid follower who has no brains.
RE:WHO IS RIGHT????
by gali on Sep 25, 2007 11:39 PM Permalink
if you believe in god,there is god in living and non living.like there is air every where.there is god in everything.if u dont believe atleast show respect to others feelings. if you cannot,probably you are the biggest butt on the world.
RE:WHO IS RIGHT????
by SAUDISLAVETOUSA on Sep 25, 2007 11:54 PM Permalink
if you believe in god,there is god in living and non living.like there is air every where.there is god in everything.if u dont believe you don't have to pay taxes that goes to HAJ,CORAL REEF PROJECT OR FOR CHURCH.if you STILL ASKED TO PAY,then that person is the biggest butt on the world.
RE:WHO IS RIGHT????
by Amitabh Kumar on Sep 25, 2007 11:34 PM Permalink
All three, but they are not MATCHBOX, BLONDE MAN OR ELEPHANT. One quote says "An idiot who considers himself brilliant is the most dangerous person of the society"
RE:WHO IS RIGHT????
by SAUDISLAVETOUSA on Sep 25, 2007 11:42 PM Permalink
One quote also say's "RELIGION IS THE OPIUM FOR THE MASSES".So Stop smoking opium.
Look at his answers. Tagodia is definitely an intelligent completely opposite of what freaking psec media makes him out to be. Morons, only if vast number of Indians knew what is right and wrong, Tagodia wouldn't be called with adjectives that he is called today.
RE:Tagodia is an Intelligent guys
by Seshadri on Sep 25, 2007 11:29 PM Permalink
yes, the answers given to counter DMK's false claims on Aryan-Dravidan divide are are equally valid, if one were to see through an impartial eye!
