In 1952, we, the people of India, accepted our Constitution & declared ourselves as a socialist secular republic with adult franchise. On that day we denied Rama & the Ramrajya.
There were elements in Hindu society then, who wanted to bring Ram Rajya. We strongly disagreed & dumped the idea of Ram Rajya. By doing that we did not dishonor India in any way, actually we did India proud.
Rama does not qualify to become our ideal & no one should ever try to force him upon us. Rama does not equate with India. India is much greater than Rama. India is a reality. Rama is a fiction, an imaginary character from an epic. Therefore, donot cry in the name of Rama!
As for Setu Samudram, it is an issue to be sorted out by experts on merits of the case alone. No foul cries of religious sentiments should be allowed to blackmail the nation.
RE:RE:He Ram !
by SSCD on Sep 15, 2007 11:53 PM Permalink
It's pity that people out on this message board are making comments on Ram and Ram-rajya without reading a single word about it!
yes we rejected Ram Rajya and brought in netas who did minority appeasement in the name of secular politics, those netas who brought in license-raj and made sure the whole economics of the country went rock-bottom, those netas who filled their coffers with black money and charged honest money-earners taxes to the tune of 80 %, those netas who brought-in 'Garibi' and later came for asking votes in the name of 'Garibi Hatav'. In whatever form, Ram rajya would have been any day better!
RE:He Ram !
by Raj on Sep 15, 2007 11:46 PM Permalink
Dept. of Earth Sciences, Government of India (March, 2007) www.stonepages.com/news/archives/002364.html
Scientific evidences point to human activity in ancient times on both sides of Ram Sethu (the narrow sea between India and Sri Lanka) as found by Dept. of Earth Sciences and ocean technologists of Bharatam. The Geological logging of the bore holes drilled in Ram Sethu reveals very interesting details. In almost of all the boreholes between 4.5 and 7.5m the borehole intersected hard formations, which have been found to be calcareous sand stones and corals. The Corals normally grow atop compact to hard formations for the purpose of stability, and as the sea level rises, the Coral colony grows up vertically to maintain water depth of 1 to 2 m, which is essential for their survival. In the case of Ram Sethu area, we observe that the Coral formations hardly occur 1 to 2.5m in length and resting on loose marine sands. Most of these coral rock pieces are seem to be rounded pebbles of corals. These things appear to point these coral rock pieces and pebbles have been transported and placed in these areas. Since the calcareous sand stones and Corals are less dense than normal hard rock and quite compact, probably these were used by the ancients to form a connecting link to Sri Lanka, on the higher elevations of the Ram Sethu ridge and this is analogous to modern day causeway. ..indicates human habitation extending to late Pleistocene (11,000 BCE) based on bone of human.
RE:He Ram !
by Marco Polo on Sep 16, 2007 12:54 AM Permalink
I believe that.The waters may have been shallow in ancient times and it would have been easier to build the structure.Anyway Sinhalese of Srilanka themselves think they came from Northern India.People were crossing to this paradise island for ages.Rameshwaram in the Tamil Nadu coast is a pilgrim center of Hindus for centuries.So wouldn't it be only wise for the 'secular' Congress and 'progressive' DMK to respect the belief of the majority? We have swindled millions,so what if we don't get a few extra dollars from shipping?
RE:He Ram !
by MGR Fan on Sep 15, 2007 11:17 PM Permalink
Sethu samudram is not about religion. It is about throwing good money after bad. Experts are bought for money by the DMK , to help Baalu make money. Sethu samudram is a first class scam of wasting money on something that does not benefit people .
RE:He Ram !
by on Sep 16, 2007 01:56 AM Permalink
how do u figure that the sethusamudram does not benefit the country... It saves time for shipping and travel by over 30 hrs. These types of projects are fundamental for india's success in the world markets. Innovative plans and ideas should not be abandoned due to backward forces and beliefs in Indian culture.
RE:He Ram !
by satish kumar on Sep 16, 2007 12:46 AM Permalink
Yes i agree ram and india are two different things. India should not be identified with particular religion. Calling india a hindu country is derogatory to me.
All Hindus including myself are coward.We can not fight like Muslims & Christans.We dont have any daring.We can just timepass in discussion board shaddow fighting.We dont have courage to fight as we are GA*DU.
RE:All Hindus are coward
by Marco Polo on Sep 16, 2007 12:47 AM Permalink
Chandrakant,we may be passive,but when we get the Ballot in our hands,we can use it wisely.
RE:All Hindus are coward
by jalsaaj on Sep 15, 2007 11:30 PM Permalink
and that's is the reason we have been salve of mugals n british 4 more than 500 years.
It's amazing how in India there are highly educated people who are scientist, IT guys, and engineers...who earn a name for India in science and technology. And on the other hand there are people sunk deep in superstition, whose lives are similar or worse than the lives people had during the dark ages in Europe.
These people are a hindrance to the growth of India. This canal project can be a booster for regional economy, but now it's affected by ignorant people.
India needs more reforms even during this modern age. It's good that India had reforms in areas like sati, untouchability, equality in education, etc. Those reforms helped India reach the level it is in now. More reforms would help in further growth, else there will be only chaos, infighting and instability.
RE:India is an interesting country...
by JGN on Sep 15, 2007 10:49 PM Permalink
Mr. JB, leave apart superstitions. The Ram Sethu is harmful to the ecology and the benefits are not as great as is being projects. The propsed canal is suitable for Ships upto 30,000 DWT only. The large vessels like Ro-ro and Lighters weighing about one lakh DWT in service at present cannot navigate thru this canal. So the entire exercise is futile.
RE:RE:India is an interesting country...
by JGN on Sep 15, 2007 10:50 PM Permalink
Pl read "the propsed Sethu Samudram Project" is harmful to the ecology............
RE:India is an interesting country...
by JB on Sep 16, 2007 04:50 AM Permalink
Well...Interesting..you are debating on the environment problems. It's true that almost all man's super construction projects affect the environment. Ports, dams, highways, expanding cities, power plants...etc..etc.. Do people stop all that? If the environment damage is too high compared to the benifits, yes the project could be stopped, but that should be the reason for the stoppage, not the reasons the article says or the people here cry about.
RE:Exact Closeup satellite view of Ram Setu :
by Global Hindu on Sep 15, 2007 10:45 PM Permalink
Do you have a job and family? You seem to have problem with everything that is not Islamic. India is non Islamic. You can try everything you want . It is a known fact that the world has a bad view on Islam and you cannot change it.
RE:RE:Exact Closeup satellite view of Ram Setu :
by Raj on Sep 15, 2007 11:44 PM Permalink
Dept. of Earth Sciences, Government of India (March, 2007)
www.stonepages.com/news/archives/002364.html
Scientific evidences point to human activity in ancient times on both sides of Ram Sethu (the narrow sea between India and Sri Lanka) as found by Dept. of Earth Sciences and ocean technologists of Bharatam.
The Geological logging of the bore holes drilled in Ram Sethu reveals very interesting details. In almost of all the boreholes between 4.5 and 7.5m the borehole intersected hard formations, which have been found to be calcareous sand stones and corals.
The Corals normally grow atop compact to hard formations for the purpose of stability, and as the sea level rises, the Coral colony grows up vertically to maintain water depth of 1 to 2 m, which is essential for their survival. In the case of Ram Sethu area, we observe that the Coral formations hardly occur 1 to 2.5m in length and resting on loose marine sands. Most of these coral rock pieces are seem to be rounded pebbles of corals. These things appear to point these coral rock pieces and pebbles have been transported and placed in these areas. Since the calcareous sand stones and Corals are less dense than normal hard rock and quite compact, probably these were used by the ancients to form a connecting link to Sri Lanka, on the higher elevations of the Ram Sethu ridge and this is analogous to modern day causeway.
..indicates human habitation extending to late Pleistocene (11,000 BCE) based on bone of human.
RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by imran patel on Sep 15, 2007 10:41 PM Permalink
That is because Muslims have become close minded. Muslim woman CAN pray in a MOSQUE. They do it in Mecca and Medina and also in the US
RE:RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by iluvtaj on Sep 15, 2007 10:46 PM Permalink
yes imran patel but what about saying "JAI HIND" first
RE:RE:RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by JGN on Sep 15, 2007 10:55 PM Permalink
Mr. Iluvtaj, pl don't taunt Mr. Imran Patel too much. He seems to be a very sensible Muslim. According to their belief, bowing to anything other than Allah is prohibited. So we should not pester him.
RE:RE:RE:RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by iluvtaj on Sep 15, 2007 11:01 PM Permalink
Thanks for your views, I am not FANATIC HINDU, i love my country and want to know in forums whether they equally love it or not. Sometime people say so bad words that it is not toelarable. I never used such words, but i want to differentiate people, why some cant show respect to their motherland if they get their bread and butter from it. IMRAN ALREADY SAID "JAI BHARAT" my question is why he cant say "JAI HIND" IS HIND word religious, pertaining to gods and JAI HIND means LONGLIVE INDIA it is NOT BOWING
RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by Diamond Cutter on Sep 15, 2007 11:10 PM Permalink
Whats your point to press say Jai Hind-? Do you think bharat is different from Hind-? Do you hahve any answer for this-?
RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by JGN on Sep 15, 2007 11:08 PM Permalink
Dear Iluvtaj, many people are under a wrong impression that majority of muslims do notlove our country. It is contrary to fact. There are ofcourse some members of their community who are not loyal to the country, but the same applies to other communities also. Hope you remember instances of members of other communities caught for epsionage, etc.
Unfortunately the Rediff forum has some controversial articles every day and at times it becomes a virtual abuse of followers of different religions.
Promote love and brother-hood among the followers of different religions as some of these actions and/or articles are promoted by vested interests for their narrow gains.
RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by desai on Sep 15, 2007 11:58 PM Permalink
Ignorance!!!
Islam is the first religion that gave women equal rights including voting rights and property rights. Islam is the first religion that banned female infanticide.
Voting for women in western cultures was only considered centuries after Muslim women were already voting.
I agree muslim men in some patriachal cultures expoloit women but the are as anti Islam as you are.
In Hindu culture women has being a part of Sati, dowry deaths and given a second class treatment. We should be the last ones to point fingers at others.
RE:RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by imran patel on Sep 15, 2007 10:42 PM Permalink
That is because Muslims have become close minded. Muslim woman CAN pray in a MOSQUE. They do it in Mecca and Medina and also in the US
RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by Marco Polo on Sep 16, 2007 12:57 AM Permalink
So which wife goes with the husband to Mecca? The 1st,2nd ,3rd or 4th?
RE:I NEVER SAW A WOMEN ENTERING OR COMING OUT OF A MOSQUE!!
by CG NAIR on Sep 15, 2007 10:41 PM Permalink
A women's worth in only half that of a man according to Allah's revealations!!!!!!!!!!!!
RE:Glorious Indian past
by for education on Sep 16, 2007 01:34 AM Permalink
Imran CV Raman, JC Bose, Ramanujan, Satyendranath Bose (of Bose-Einstein Statistics), H. Bhabha, M. Saha, S. Chandrasekhar - to name a few recent ones.
I am really sorry if i am offending anyone religious sentiments here. I am curious to know about the life of Ram and differ with due respects some of the beliefs. I believe in Hindu's religious philosophy which says "Believe whatever brings you peace of mind as long as it dosent hurt anyone"
Ram on the other hand has done some mistakes in our most revered hym Ramayan. I didnt like it when he killed Vaali from behind instead of confronting him head-on. Its against our dharma to stab anyone from behind or hiding. He asked sita to sleep in fire to prove her fidelity. Most indian men are possesive and always suspect their wives because of this. Ram left sita in forests when she was pregnant just because his people didnt accept her. No loving husband will abandon his wife that too when she is pregnant. My argument is why God almighty Ram who is the virtuous did the above mentioned things. Please note i am a Hindu and dont like anti-hinduism stand of our politicians. I believe the hindu way of life. Despite being an atheist i am still a hindu because hinduism accepts all beliefs. Atheism is also a kind of belief and i am not offending anyone in my life. My apologies once again if i unintentionally hurt anyone. I am not against Ram, just dont understand some of the mistakes made by Ram in Ramayan. He also did so many good deeds as well.
RE:Ram Ram
by MGR Fan on Sep 15, 2007 11:15 PM Permalink
Natesh,
For first time i am finding someone who says he is Athiest, but same time very polite and humble in posting. Keep the good work.
Ramayan I would say is about the limitations and difficulties and mistakes commited by God when god becomes human. That way if you see you can understand
Yes, vaali killing was first mistake. even before that, he accepted sita's request for joining him in forest. That showed lack of judgement (another human phenomenon). Then of course, was the fire test (which is likely to be latter day insertion). And finally sending her to forest during pregnancy. (there is one version that says that Sita wished to stay in the Sage valmiki's place instead of palace). Finally sita devi left to bottom of earth, Rama was left lonely and realising his mistake. That is the highlight, shows how gods also in human forms make mistake. The mistake repeatedly done is trying to over committ or over please everyone. One canot please everyone, one must , ignore what some idiots say and not give importance. that is one message
RE:Ram Ram
by Maan Singh on Sep 15, 2007 11:41 PM Permalink
try to read ramayan ,you will not find your answers here on rediff, as this is not right place 2 discuss religion. If you are hindu than its shame you dont know you religion , get converted and embrace christ or allah
