Lets leave guns and talk about polls. If polls can not solve kashmir issue, do you think your baseless rant of freedom can solve it.
You are demanding freedom from a free country. Have you ever came across anything as absurd as that ?
I would encourage you to provide some logical reasons for demanding freedom. Prepare a concrete plan and present it to the world.
While on one hand you have utterly failed in pointing out the defficiencies in Indian constitution that forces you to demand freedom, on the other you have miserably failed to justify your demand for freedom because we are already free.
You guys harp on the four point formula of Mr Mushrraf. Do you know what his real formula is ? To bomb the hide outs of separatists as he did in balochistan. Do you really want us to follow Mr Musharraf formulas ?
Its time you become matured leaders and listen to peoples voice and do something good to them by taking part in elections. You can really do a lot. But you are shying away from that and taking the easier route of shouting for a baseless freedom.
Well.. shouting for freedom is your livelihood now. And if a person/s livelihood depends upon not understanding the truth, its hard to make him understand the truth, no mater how simple it be.
I CHALLENGE Hurriyat to do even a little bit of thing that would bring happiness on face of kashmiris.
I CHALLENGE them to see to it that kashmiris enjoy good standard of living. To see to it that they start a movement to build schools and colleges.
I CHALLENGE them to see to it that kashmiriS roads, lakes and countryside are free from garbage and pollution.
I CHALLENGE them to see to it that industries come to kashmiris to invest and increase local employment.
I CHALLENGE them to take care that kashmiris do not cripple the only thing they are good at... tourism.... Sadly now they have started throwing grenades at tourists. So their hospitality has also gone away.. can hurriyat stop this ?
I CHALLENGE hurriyat to see to it that all infrastructure projects in the state get completed on time and fast.
I CHALLENGE hurriyat to urge indian government to exted rail network from jammu onwards to leh, just like china has a rail network in tibet.
I CHALLENGE hurriyat to see o it that the state has enough energy resources to meet the demands of future prosperity.
I CHALLENGE hurriyat to see to it that all kashmiris get security.. and cross border infiltration stops.
I CHALLENGE hurriyat to see to it that kashmir becomes good again.
Now is the fun part of it. While the Indian government painstakingly tries to do all of the above, our beloved hurriyat leaders only try to increase anti India activities.
A true example of man not freed from fundamentalism even after educating himself in presigious University. There are about 50,000 Kashmiri Hindus were killed from 1991: http://www.factusa.org/totalexhibit/exhibition.asp
Look at these. How islamic terrorists turned Kashmir into a muslim major state. So any voting would not give justice. How about we kill all the muclims in pakistan and declare that as Hindu major state?? Do you think that is okay? It is true India has problems and oppresions of Govts. It is everywhere. But that does not mean that a state has to get freedom from Govt. You can change the Govt being a part of the country without being a terrorists. You talk about truth? How do you fathom truth with your five sense? The truth is we can only see or understand 3 D of this world whereas this world has 10-20 dimensions. Do you think reading a book can give you idea of truth-no way. Try to read String theory and quantum mechanics if you are searching truth. Do not read a fanatic religious book.
RE:@ Azan Rashid
by derc cruse on May 22, 2007 04:23 AM Permalink
(Continued) Some people think preaching one idea would result in a better world. Try to look at the history if that is the case. Turning whole world into islam would not solve any problem. You will still have Shia, Sunni, Kurd problems and people will kill people even with same Allahs name. Try to look at with one Jesus howmany factions of Christians are created, and the bloodshed between protestant and catholics is well known fact. Hindus have the same history. Once Shivites used to fight Vaishnavites. So turning world into mono culture will result nothing. Even God does not want that. Thats why he created this diverse world. Therefore, liberating Kashmir will only result in more problems. See Pakistan. Even after 50 years of partition still struggling with democracy. Riots are plenty at the streets. See Bangladesh- a poorest country in the world. Did they solve their problem by truning into similar culture? Is God blessing them? Noway. See the examples available to you. Rationalize them. Then talk. Look at the world. The country that favors diversity is the country improving. Look at Europe. They are going down as they do not promote diversity. USA is emerging as it is the most diverse country.
RE:@ Azan Rashid
by derc cruse on May 22, 2007 04:26 AM Permalink
@ continued
Do not provide me the example of CHina as that is a paper lion like USSR. It will collapse in future or sometime very soon. ANyway China also had to open its door to diversity to go at par with improvement. Look at these and then think about your dreamed islamic world. Didnt Meer Ja Far helped British even Siraj Ud Doula was muslim? So? This is the truth.
RE:@ Azan Rashid
by ashish sinha on May 22, 2007 07:26 AM Permalink
well said bro....
well said..... creating independent states is not going to solve the problem. If we go by the logic of Hurriyat, then every household should have its own constitution, president, priminister, army and what not.
I think these guys dont understand the meaning of love and peace and they dont deserve any special treatment from other states of India and our Central Govt. Pakistan is a real Piss -tan and deserves to be dealt sternly.
No need of any mercy and I see posts of some Pakis here.
Openly supporting J&K seperation --- do you know guys why -- the reason is simple their country Pak has got no net connections and they deal with only guns and can only kill innocent people or blow themselves up in some plane of hijack some thing :-)
some fake guy says he is Harvard passout --- can spell things properly and who gives a rat ass even if you are passed out from Harvard or Oxford --- please go and dont piss us.
To hell with you and your Jehad. --- We Indians dont want to talk or compare to a country living in 18th century medevial world.
We have left you guys far far behind and now we dont compare our selves to you.
So stop fooling around in Indian room and go and marry your cousins or kill some innocent guys ---
If you consider separatist correct then first they should stop the pakistani sponsered milanty. Give up your guns, India will suspend elections.
then. 1. Get back the sold part of kashmir to china.(aksai china)
2. Kick all the pakistani settelers back to their country.
3. Bring all the displaced native kashmiri people (including pundits) back to kashmir.
4. Give 5 years timeframe for things to settle down and have peaceful life for kashmiries.
4. Hold referendum in all the state of kashmir including nothern kashmir which pakistan thinks is their territory.
Then olny peace will prevail in kashmir. All these pakistani sponsered and Indian government paid (yes, indian tax payers are paying their health bills, touring bills) separatist should be put bhind bars before such referndum has to take place.
I have been reading all the messages in this forum and there are several arguments for and against Indian Forces in Kashmir, "Azad" Kashmir and Kashmir independency.
Serveral Musalmaan "brothers" advocate the cause of force withdrawal by India so that Kashmir can claim independency.
However when asked about the topic of displacement and murder of the Kashmiri pandits, my "musalmaan" brothers hesitate to reply or answer.
So what my musalmaan brother want is an Islamic Kashmir and not an independant Kashmir. They want to turn Kashmir into another Afganistan.
I used to be pro-Kasmir but now I have changed my views. Indian should not give up even a pin's head of land. Kashmir ya Kanyakumari, its all India.
In my humble opinion if a person cannot take the heat in the kitchen, he/she must get out. Similarly if you dont like India, please get out! And get the door while you are getting out.
first they will ask for a president, primeminister, constitution, EC and army. Finally once they are free they will convert the state into a terrorist country based on Islam. all other ppl will be wiped out as only islam can be practised in an Islamic state. these losers will never get a pie out of kashmir. let them die with the dream of a free kashmir.
U guys must be crazy...Please resign from power! I am sure you guys wouldn't clear a psychological evaluation...Kashmir is an integral part of india...Splitting countries on the basis of the flimsy grounds of religion wouldn't bode well for india or any other country for that matter...Look at the pakis-never came up beyond a certain point...The whole country came into existence because of "insecurities" and "biases"...
How about a peaceful partician 1)Have election under international community and determine how many people in kashmir(valley and POK) want to choose pak and how many india. 2)Compensation and peaceful relocation should be allowed to settle in Pok by indian kashmiris and for POK folks to settle in indian kashmir
Is that not simple? if a overwhelming majority chose pak we can probably make some concession in land too later on.
Atleast these kashmiris need not be fed billions of rupees from center each year.And in the end of it all govt gets is bad will for all the billions spent
RE:Peaceful Partician
by Debashish Chatterjee on May 22, 2007 02:21 AM Permalink
No - its not that simple and here is why to both of your points.
1) The demographics in the region has shifted considerably because of violence and political unrest in the last few decades. So how do you determine the original inhabitants of the state which is now full of illegal immigrants and terrorists - not to mention questions around LOC? 2) Utopian. If that happens the problem is solved.
RE:Peaceful Partician
by Cnu on May 22, 2007 02:02 AM Permalink
No partition. Lets abolish article 370 and allow all Indians to settle in Kashmir.After all, all these Lones and Gilani's are descendants of migrated people. These zihadis and separatists were not the original dwellers of Kashmir. Why should we even care about these foreigners who are living in our land. lets throw them out and make Kashmir ours.
