why you want to perform puja. stop complaing about such things. if the temple owners think it is their private property build your own temple. if that is not allowed either convert to buddism or chritianity or muslim whatver you want.
why do u want to follow such religion which does not allow you to do what you want without any reason or with reason you do not accept?
RE:Dalit
by Chhora Allahabadi on Mar 29, 2007 01:00 AM Permalink
Prashant, I do not like the idea of stopping people to enter in temples. I did not liked even your Idea of converting people to any other relegion. In my opionion fight for this cause instead of leave it as it is and move to some other relegion. It's not a solution.
RE:Dalit
by Prashant on Mar 29, 2007 01:15 AM Permalink
I never said people should be stopped from entering temples nither I said run away from the problem. but I think mandir entrance movement are just wastage of time and energy. (It is be hard to change the thousands of year contaminated mindset)
The caste system is an after effect of people's social, political, economic and mental slavary.
First complaining about temple entrance shows mental slavary which leads to all the other types of slavaries.
If you decide to revolt against the current customs and rituals, that shows your mental freedom. thus it would lead to social, economic and political freedom which will make the indian society free of caste system and prosporus one.
RE:Dalit
by Ramesh Sharma on Mar 29, 2007 01:26 AM Permalink
you can not make night into day and day into night,same as you can not change the brahmins superiority.we are supreme in the world
RE:Dalit
by Prashant on Mar 29, 2007 01:34 AM Permalink
bhaiya Ramesh,
If the "Brahmin sanatan dharma" is implemented in it real and original form, people like you and suresh bhatt would be the first one to become ati-shudras. bhaiya pahele padho what is meant by brahmins and them say you are a brahmin :-) People like you give brahmins bad name and then enticejuan complains that common brahmins dont do anything wrong.
RE:[object]
by Mukesh Garg on Mar 29, 2007 01:43 AM Permalink
Very correctly said Prashant... Ramesh...if you think honestly, people like you are only responsible for the thousands of years of slavery of entire India, as you never wanted India to be a united one. Ramesh bhai...is castism ne is desh ke pehle hi kitne tukde karwaaye hain...ab to aaf karo. Kab samajh aayegi tumhe yeh baat, jab tum aur tumhaare kuchh saathi ek chhote se taapu per bach jaaoge aur baaki desh ke tukde ho chuke honge.
RE:Dalit
by Save Hinduism on Mar 29, 2007 04:47 AM Permalink
Hey he is just aliasing as brahmin..he is someone else. But even if he is brahmin, he is demented one. There are rotten apples everywhere
RE:Dalit
by Aryaputra on Mar 29, 2007 05:16 AM Permalink
Great truth every hindu should realize!! A brahmin is by deeds not by birth. I see many brahmins eat non-veg and not study the vedas or anything. But shudras do everything. So the man with the best deed is a brahmin
RE:Dalit
by friend full on Mar 29, 2007 03:25 AM Permalink
Are you joking that deeds make Brahmin, Not a bad definition, but Alas! your definition stands only for you. I respect what you are, but the so called Brahmin and uppercaste wont embrace you my dear. It is beacuase of them there are millions and millions of Muslims and christians, whose forefathers converted due to their behaviour. Hinduism is changing I think you should thank other religions for it, otherwise lower castes would have been still treated as animals.
RE:Dalit
by AlarmedAquarian on Mar 29, 2007 05:34 AM Permalink
Your brahmin superiority is being dalitised by mayawati & how every other caste love it !!!
RE:Dalit
by Mukesh Garg on Mar 29, 2007 01:37 AM Permalink
Dear Prashant, Stopping dalits from entering temples is not as common now as it used to be. How come this change worked after thousands of years of contaminated mindset? Its working itself shows that things are changing fast.
In todays world, we all are suffering from this caste-cancer that have spoiled our Hindu religion. I am not against anyone who wants to convert but at the same time, I would call for strong fight against any castism, instead of giving up.
It started changing only after Dr. Ambedkar decided to embrass buddhism. (People should be thankful to him that he did not convert to either christianity or islam). It sent a wave, and waked up alsleep brahmins and uppercaste. that is when things started changing. Otherwise even Dr. Ambedkar was frustrated with their behaviour after Kalaram temple entrance movement.
RE:[object]
by Mukesh Garg on Mar 29, 2007 01:49 AM Permalink
Definitely Prashant, This slap was very much required to self oriented so called upper class. Now when it has already happened, and today we have media power, we should call for unity of hinduism. Believe me, I am proud to ba a Hindu (provided there is no cast system). But when I think of casts, I feel we have the most unfortunate relegion where we ourself have created so many silly divisions. I will say again, now is the correct time for a grand fight ( with all the means available). Give a big fight and then leave if you wish. Those ppl shud get a big lesson before you make a big change in your life.
RE:Dalit
by G S on Mar 29, 2007 12:36 AM Permalink
Prashant, I like some part of your answer but also like to emphasize that the public temple is not the property of anybody and if he is not allowed it should be brought to notice of court. We should not get defeated like this. The temple belongs to everybody and dalit who is qualified can be pujari in that nobody by law can be able to stop that.
It became a caste much later.Brahmin is an idea.It stands for somebody who is educated in vedas,who is disciplined,clean,religious and follows morality.I think all dalits,kayasths and others should try to become brahmin in idea rather than make them untouchable.We should all try to be a brahmin and become close to brahman.Btw am not a brahmin.
RE:Brahmin is an idea
by Prashant on Mar 29, 2007 12:23 AM Permalink
blue,
you are correct. The real dharma has remained only in documents. When we see it in the real world it is drastically different and ambigous.
I guess the only dharma originated in this land which makes sense in contemporary world is buddhism. which is still the way it is described in the documents and relatively less abused because of the douments maintained by other asian countries. otherwise every dmarma (way of life) defined by our forefathers has been abused and distorted by some greedy people.
RE:Brahmin is an idea
by Jay Sastry on Mar 29, 2007 04:13 AM Permalink
Prashant, India has not reached a stage where a real dharma only remains in documents. Not everyone but there are atleast a handful of people with qualities defined by you in your previous reply. What I don't understand is your motive behind promoting Buddism and suggesting people to convert to Buddism. Is this one of the qualities described in the document???
Mayawati know that Brahmins are superior than other lower caste. Brahmins are ruling the world since thousand of years and because of brahmins all the religious activities can perform otherwise who could do it. nobody.Everybody should respect brahmins.
RE:Mayawati know Brahmins
by Ramesh P on Mar 28, 2007 11:52 PM Permalink
Suresh, r u drunk, no Brahmin talks this way. No one is a Brahmin by birth, How much of the "Brahma Gyan" do u know to call yourself a Brahmin ?? Or you should be a brainwashed dalit writing in a Brahmin name to spread hatred between brothers.
RE:Mayawati know Brahmins
by Aryaputra on Mar 29, 2007 05:32 AM Permalink
suresh - you do not become a brahmin by birth or by wearing a sacred thread. A brahmin is the one who devotes his life to the study of the brahman - the supreme soul.
Am a brahmin but never considered myself superior to anyone because of caste. Grow up!!
The best way to go would be if each state in India got divided and became a separate nation. That way none of us would be blaming each others community. Politicians in Delhi need to rethink and bring out this concept to fruition.
RE:Indian Problem
by G S on Mar 28, 2007 11:21 PM Permalink
Hi Mr. Pakistani...don't hide by Sachin name..pakistan will get divide first. Your effort to bleed india in kashmir and kill baloch in balochistan will divide pakistan more quickly than you think. India and indians will stand united. Mayabati's effort will go in this direction in long way.
1. It explicitly creates hierarchy among Indians which is against Article 14 ie Right to Equality. 2. Parents covertly preach their children to coerce other children as per the above hierarchies.
RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by G S on Mar 28, 2007 11:23 PM Permalink
You are not hindu or you do not understand it. At best you are pakistani, and i believe why you are shouting why Jihad (terror) doesn't belong to Islam. Yes I agree it doesn't belong to islam but u have corrupted it. Similarly Hinduism like any other religion has been corrupted by some powerful persons and started using the task based divsion to caste. Anybody who will do pooja is brahmin (and not can do pooja). But i can not make u understand.
RE:RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by Prashant on Mar 28, 2007 11:29 PM Permalink
G.S. why everyone denouncing "brahmin's sanatan dharma" has to be muslim or pakistani?
Read about your dharma first, what exactly "hindu" religion means and what are its pros and cons bfore start abusing people.
RE:RE:RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by G S on Mar 28, 2007 11:40 PM Permalink
Yes Prashant: you or he can be indian ..but not hindu. So u have no rights to misinterpret the religion.
I am not a brahmin myself but i am hindu and i know what i telling.
Hinduism has been corrupted by vested people and it is a fact. Similar to other religion. No religion can claim that it is not corrupted in one way or other.
If you do not agree then u are falsifying yourself.
RE:RE:RE:RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by SI on Mar 29, 2007 02:56 AM Permalink
cut this crap. Baghawath gita clearly says, about different groups Brahmins, Kshatriyas, shudras, etc. and it even specifies various punishments for dalits if they try to mix with upper caste. So keep your philosophy with you only.
RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by AK on Mar 29, 2007 07:00 AM Permalink
Dear "SL",
In Bhagwat Geeta a person is chatagarized in a perticular group based upon his "deeds". "shudra" is one of the classifications, if a person has commited any sin or anything unethical then he is called as "shudra".
keep your half knowledge with yourself ...it can be dangerous!
Being a brahmin myself from childhood anything happens in this country always the fingers goes towards brahmin ,is it hindu muslims brahmins it is between dalit brahmins and even comparision between OBC and brahmin and even in international articles of india's caste system it is brahmins always been the soft target, and in fact this country always had less percentage of brahmins and now it is decreased a lot then official figures says , may in next coming 20 years there will be hardly 5% of india's population will be brahmins ,Wonder against which caste would they make as next soft target .
RE:RE:well brahmins are now easy punch bags
by Prashant on Mar 28, 2007 11:21 PM Permalink
entice,
I agree with you. but have you ever thought why this happens. This is because, brahmins always try to protect their identity and try to force others to identify themselves the way brahmins want. offcource there are some economic reasons for it.
If they let people define their identity, they will be free some such accusaitons. :-) Let sikhs, jains buddhist ligayats, vaishnavas, shaivas identify themselves the way they want insted of bundling them in a fictitions religion "Hindu". Let people have freedom of work, worship and speech no one will blame brahmins. :-) Do not try to behave liv "hindu" religion is their private property.
RE:well brahmins are now easy punch bags
by Ramesh P on Mar 29, 2007 12:03 AM Permalink
I agree with you to some extent that the brahmins have hijacked hinduism to some extent, but thier contributions to Indian culture and religion cannot be ignored. They were also the custodians of the culture, and thats the reason why those who want to attack hinduism, attack the brahmins. But now-a-days as the author mentions, brahmins are social untouchables (partly because of the deeds of thier fore-fathers) and partly because of reverse discrimination due to the raise of Dalit, OBC etcc and the politicians and community leaders were the ones to be blamed for the division of Hindus. Brahmins, I see in south india, live for themselves and they hardly have a word in power, jobs, govt support etcc. South India is place where the brahmins live in much more worser condition than in the north, mainly because of thier lesser numbers. Unlike North India, in south india the brahmins are less than 2% of the population. No one needs thier votes, no leader to represent thier community and no one cares them. But Hindu unity is important more than anything else and if it requires the sacrifice of few communities, we should be ready to do that.
RE:well brahmins are now easy punch bags
by G S on Mar 29, 2007 12:08 AM Permalink
I am also for Indian UNITY. Do not get misled by some fictitous names and personality on the message boards, who want to divide us.
RE:well brahmins are now easy punch bags
by Prashant on Mar 29, 2007 12:18 AM Permalink
G.S thanks for using somewhat correct word "Indian Unity". I guess people living in the cubcontinent have lost their real identity.
Hindu is a word given by muslims, Indian by british, shin-hu by chinese. even we are not sure of aryavrata :-)
RE:well brahmins are now easy punch bags
by Ramasubramaniam Iyer on Mar 28, 2007 11:44 PM Permalink
Agreed. Ordinary Brahmins like me dont go about telling how other castes should behave. We have come forward. Our bosses at our workplace are everything from Muslims to Brahmins and Dalits.
The question is Brahmins are comparatively less in number than other castes/religions Dalits have 69% reservation in Tamil Nadu and now almost 50% elsewhere (And that with less no of marks need to pass than the Brahmins) We dont go about telling muslims/other castes/ 90% of Brahmins in India fight for survival(Along with other castes) to make both ends meet. So where does Brahmin come into picture atleast not in this day and age buddy
RE:well brahmins are now easy punch bags
by Prashant on Mar 28, 2007 11:55 PM Permalink
no one does it directly. it happens indirectly when you support people who does that. no one alone can do it. When you support people who force people to accept what you believe in.
for e.g.(and strictly for example) if you support RSS you are indirectly supporting their views and their agenda.
I wonder,how Mr.Prasad is paradoxically worried about intelligence.As far as A layamn knows intelligence is based on Logic & lady of Logic has sledom smiled upon Mr. Prasad.May be he thought Mayawati would smile upon this article, but she's an astute politician with no regard for Lord Macaulay or English.Is Mr. Prasad Lsitening?
