It all depends on whether human rights activists can fight animal right activists.. its ok to have animal rights... but at what costs? human life? no way should this be accepted. actually there shud have been some time frame like if at all this problem doesnt get solved in say 5 yrs....switch to plan B. and plan B cud be anything from killing them to exporting them to dog eating nations!
Anirudh, I never meant that we ought to have contempt for non-human creatures, or that we should be INDIFFERENT to their suffering. All I mean is that, as the problem stands in India today, there is no choice but to eliminate a major chunk of stray dogs, if not the entire population. Stray dogs WERE sweet and affectionate. But, paraphrasing you, IN THE PAST. The relationship WAS harmonious, when we had only two or three stray dogs in a large area, not when 10 of them prowl every bylane & gully. There is a big error in the conviction that dogs bite only on provocation. I have SEEN dogs bite people WITHOUT ANY provocation whatsoever. Otherwise, their teeming presence would not have generated such universal phobia & abhorrence. Honestly, marauding stray dogs are NOT one tenth as friendly & harmless as animal lovers assert. Strays fed by local residents maybe so, but only as long as they are scarce & alone. & only with those who feed them. Once their no. crosses a certain limit, they become bold, aggressive, hostile, violent, & unpredictably dangerous. Even crafty & cunning. They evolve hitherto slumbering skills of attacking other animals & people, of obtaining food, of controlling the environment around them. The ruthless struggle for DOMINANCE was SUPRESSED when we had just a couple of dogs around. Once they start forming packs, they develop specific group dynamics, since originally they were pack hunters like wolves. Many undesirable patterns of behavior resurface, never expected before. They lose fear of men, learn how to form networks, position members strategically, & actually draw up a proper plan of action to attack other animals & human beings!
If a wolf or tiger killed a man, NO ONE would want ALL wolves or tigers to be exterminated. WHY? Why is there no move for mass extermination of hyenas or jackals or snakes? Or bulls, which kill people not infrequently? Why does nobody want cats, or cows, or pigs, or monkeys, to be eliminated? That is bcoz the NATURE OF THE PROBLEM is different. These creatures do not create the unhealthy environment which stray dogs do. Scorpions & spiders can be VERY dangerous, but apart from practical difficulties, no one wants them to be eliminated, bcoz they DO NOT pose the menace & threat which stray dogs do. Nature has NOT designed stray dogs to co-exist with men in such large, uncontrollable numbers.
No sensitive person enjoys the sight of an animal being electrocuted or buried alive. It is very unfortunate that this is done. Perhaps, it is a necessary evil? One way out is to adopt & ensure properly humane methods of inducing (painless) death. By PRIVATE agencies. With private funds & donations. I oppose the idea of mass euthanization, vaccination & sterilization by the govt. as national policy or law, bcoz I think it is INJUSTICE to spend CRORES on welfare of (22 MILLION) stray dogs in a country where a woman dies every 7 minutes in childbirth due to lack of medical facilities. Where people are starved & desperate enough to sell their own children to procure food. Where 300 million people r still illiterate. Protection of strays against human cruelty, their vaccination & sterilization, maybe a PRIVATE effort. I would NEVER demand the government of a country as poor as ours, to deflect funds from human resources to animals. That is okay in countries like the USA, which have enormous surplus wealth & a very high standard of living. They can afford it. We cannot. Not at this stage of development.
Once people are taken care of, animals shall be taken care of too. Man first, animals next. In any choice between men and animals, I will chose human beings. Regarding humanity itself, I DO see why you are so discontented with mankind. But you are NOT seeing the process of civilization, the evolution of society, the movement of history, the total picture, Anirudh. You are TOO unhappy about Man. There is no cause for SO strong an anger. If glory existed in the past, it can be resurrected in the future. All I can say is that one ought to view human nature in a more positive light. I am writing a book on genocide. I KNOW what human cruelty & evil is. But that does not make me forget that, in the ultimate analysis, Man is a SPLENDID creature. He maybe Hitler or Nero or Attila, but he can also be Shakespeare, Joan of Arc, Albert Einstein, Aurobindo, Michelangelo, Louis Pasteur, & Socrates.
I think that the BIGGEST error most people make is that, for them, a crime/murder committed by a MAN, is ANALOGOUS to an attack/death caused by stray dogs %u2013 that these are comparable situations & are on the same plane. In truth, they are two totally different situations, though there is a victim, a death/immense suffering & a victimizer, in both. No, if someone who is dear to me is killed, I would NOT go around killing all people, because that%u2019s simply not the way to regulate things in human society, AMONGST human beings. But that doesn%u2019t mean that we should give up ritual elimination of stray dogs. I begin by making a strict distinction between HUMAN LIFE, & NON-HUMAN LIFE. People who think that somehow human life is just about as valuable %u2013 or rather, as valueless %u2013 as animal life, cannot be argued with. While they rant against murderers, jihadis, criminals etc etc, they forget that it is precisely THIS attitude: equating the value of human life to that of animal life, that is at the root of all crime, war, genocide & all. For a man like Hitler, the 6 million Jews he killed were no more than rodents in a mass experiment. ANY discussion has to begin with the premise that human life is PRICELESS & SACROSANCT, & that THE RULES APPLICABLE IN DEALING WITH HUMAN BEINGS ARE **RADICALLY DIFFERENT** FROM THE RULES TO BE USED IN DEALING WITH NON-HUMANS. Note the term %u201Chuman animals%u201D coined by animal-lovers: for them, human beings are no better - & in fact WORSE, than animals. ANY discusson is possible only when we realize that Man%u2019s PRIMARY FOCUS has to be MAN %u2013 other things follow that priority.
As for why ritual elimination is necessary, amongst many points, the one I'd like to stress is that stray dogs are a menace EVERYWHERE - in ALL places, - & to people ALL OVER THE COUNTRY. And INCREASINGLY so. Thousands of people get bitten everyday - in all parts of India; children are worst effected - EVERYWHERE - the cases are NOT being reported to the public, & are hushed up. Getting bitten by a stray dog is a very traumatic incident, if not always fatal - and I have had personal experience of seeing several accidents due to their unpredictable & hostile behavior. While you may punish or exterminate a particular dog responsible for a specific death, it has to be grasped that this is a rising trend. And while one may take action against a specific dog %u2013 which is NOT a solution from ANY point of view %u2013 at the same time, another 500 dogs have bitten another 500 people maybe somewhere in Assam or Andaman or Chennai or Kolkata. That, if this situation, which is already out-of-control, %u2013 exacerbates & multiplies, the number of deaths & attacks shall only increase. That while today only one child has died in one city (which is a gross understatement) %u2013 tomorrow TWENTY children will die in 20 other cities. Dogs are the same everywhere %u2013 under all varieties of circumstances %u2013 and there is no way to educate or train or tame millions of them. What we see today, is merely the tip of an iceberg that looms large & dark in an unseen future. There are MANY important points, Vishwajeet, WHY dogs have to be treated ON DIFFERENT PRINCIPLES than human beings. That would require going into a lot of philosophical discussion, which space on this forum doesn%u2019t provide. For example, as to concept of Rights, one has to ask questions like: What ARE Rights? On what basis has the concept of (human) rights been built? What purpose do they serve? WHY should we have rights? What about responsibility & accountability?
I have not forgotten the evil man is capable of: but I am also intensely aware of the greatness man is capable of. Terrorists & murderers do not DEFINE human nature %u2013 just like a rabid dog is NOT a representative of dogs in general. Rather, the truth is the opposite: Man is defined by the HIGHEST he is capable of, NOT the lowest. This is issue which requires EXTENSIVE discussion & debate %u2013 I don%u2019t think any discussion forum provides scope for such exhaustive deliberation. If you want further clarification, & more questions, ask them freely. I would be glad to answer you.
RE:Addressed to Vishwajeet
by anirudh on Mar 20, 2007 11:03 PM Permalink
Death is death.Both humans and animals feel the same amount of physical pain.Their beloved ones also experience the same agony.You say human life is priceless.What actions of humans concurs with that statement?We lack the basic manners of taking care of our home(Earth).After the dreadful arrival of humans on this planet,we have spelt DOOM for Earth.We've turned it into a wretched garbage disposal.You give your statements,"rules should be radically different,etc...",but you dont say a word on why it is so?You are merely driven by your heritage,and have been conditioned to think thus.You should first ponder upon a printed matter,if ambiguous,then vouch for it in public. If man is defined on his highest capabilty,then why a different criterion in judging animals?Since most street dogs are friendly,loyal,and love-hungry,why not give your testimonial on them as 'Man's best friend'?Why as amoral,and insane?The Human Rights on the constitution is a mere parchmentation of man's arrogance.If all we are capable of is dwelling on our felicity,then why not insulate us against ourselves?Why venture into other beings,who are abide by the LAW OF NATURE?Why perpetrate malediction on others ,when we ourselves are the miscreant malefactors of this planet which is on the pinnacle of annihilation??The problem is,that your statement;"the highest man IS capable of"should be re-transcribed as "Man WAS" .Discrepancy of man's behavior has started to spread like a cancer within the veins of all homo-sapiens.Our scientific name itself contains the word "Homo", which means alike, also means avaricious.We think inwards,only of ourselves.If humans should be judged on what they ARE best capable of, in the present tense,then im afraid they are MANTELSHELVES OF MURDER AND GORY.Thats the "HIGEST",so that defines us.While you see only the tip of the ice-berg,I see more.I see that there is NO FUTURE for Earth, because God has forsaken it a decrepitude ago...
RE:RE:Addressed to Vishwajeet
by rohit on Mar 23, 2007 08:37 AM Permalink
exactly....animals have da same feelings as v humans do...v have just come to the conclusion dat humans r da sole owners of this planet... there r other creatures too which hold equal rights to earth as v do..... even da smallest of insects does.... an v are no one to drive them out...just bcoz v have the power of reasoning v think v can dominate this planet.just remember...humans learnt half of what they no today from observing animals.. so what v r doing by driving away these dogs... or animals in general is like learning all that v did from our parents and in the end stabbing them in the back...just remember.... dogs have hearts too... and they can feel pain... as much as v do... v have hospitals to take care of us...they have us...
RE:Addressed to Vishwajeet
by on Apr 16, 2007 05:43 PM Permalink
Come on..........just think what will happen to ur family in your absence...human is not important, but he has huge responsibility and commitment towards his family...his kid's educations, wife's welfare, taking care of his mom and dad...that most of the animals dont have.....think practically...
RE:RE:Addressed to Vishwajeet
by Buddhadev Kar on Mar 21, 2007 01:46 AM Permalink
AGAIN!!! NO ABUSE, NO OFFENSIVE STATEMENT, AND YET THE MSG DOES NOT APPEAR! This website should provide a list of the words which are considered offensive & abusive! How do we know what is acceptable & what is not?? I just do not understand why should a perfectly calm & inoffensive msg NOT be posted. This can be very irritating!
The stray dogs are a big menace to the society in general and especially to the kids and the senior citizens. In my opinion instead of killing, the stray dogs should be sterilized and then let it free. In this way their population will slowly decrease without being violent to them
Vishwajeet, I did answer your questions - and, in that reply, that of many others. But despite the fact that there is no offensive word or the slightest antagonistic tenor, they have not been posted. It seems as if only the msgs written in disagreement & criticsim have got posted. I have tried many times. There are no abusive words or statements. You can see an abuse alert 3 times beneath ur entry: but, actually, there were NO objectionable words. I don't know how to answer you, if the msg simply doesn't appear.
