RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 11:04 PM Permalink
DAYDREAMIN....come to reality ...dont send in small lines without a little thought about its practicablity..... Do you realize if such a thing were to materialize it could create more problems then the problems you are hoping to be resolved in ur dreams.....
RE:RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by A Chaterjee on Jun 17, 2007 10:44 PM Permalink
what a joke.. if u really believe this ..than relax man relax.. why we r shouting against missioneries or Dalai Lama and have made Dara Singh ur God.. respect all religion and think in a practical way Mr. Swan
RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:45 PM Permalink
not necessaryly thay might convert. They might just be non alligned to any religion. This might happen to Hiduims as well....
RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by A Chaterjee on Jun 17, 2007 10:50 PM Permalink
can u please give me the answer? suppose a muslim wants to be a hindu, what will be its cast? Brahmin or Dalit? if he becomes Brahmin will you allow him in your puja ghar as a preis? if he becomes a dalit will india Govt. will give him reseravtion? if the answer of the 2nd question is yes.. then i would like to be a Dalit rather than the Brahmin (as i am now). actually most of the hindus converted to islam for cast system.. this is thereality
RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by A Chaterjee on Jun 17, 2007 10:57 PM Permalink
what rubbish.. we used to say hindus are converting as missionaries are giving them money, education etc. so we have no right to say any word against missionaries.. as "people looking for material gains should not b allowed in any religion".. we dont need those hindus
RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by imam on Jun 17, 2007 11:14 PM Permalink
Wrong, India doesnt need you as you are most likely to be an agent from across the border, so please spare us the trouble of reading through your hate filled posts
RE:RE:''islam'' nearing its end
by imam on Jun 17, 2007 11:25 PM Permalink
1, you are not a bhramin 2, you are a Paki or closet paki 3 you cant spell caste properly, so you have studied in a Madrassa 4 Caste system is not mentioned in the vedas, it is class system where people were divided in terms of their professions 5 hinduism doesnt lay emphasis in conversion, so , your statement "people would have been interested if there was no caste" is irrelevant Hinduism doesnt accept bigots like you, you are only good at smellling your own flatulence Learrn respect for the country that feeds you
RE:America is losing in Iraq and desperately searching for a face saving exit
by imam on Jun 17, 2007 11:10 PM Permalink
robin hood, hahahahahaahahaahahaahha atleast get a user id that is compatible with your relegion.. bigot, why dont you go and join them
RE:ISLAM CAN SURVIVE ONLY UNDER THEOCRACY!!!
by imam on Jun 17, 2007 11:18 PM Permalink
Wow , your madrassa doesnt even teach you to count properly 70 years and india will become Muslim majority country, ha ha and we will stand by and let you raise the green flag at red fort ..ha ha. Get a life !!!,technology will make Islam irrelevant in a few years time, but hey sunnis and shias will kill each other wont they?
RE:ISLAM CAN SURVIVE ONLY UNDER THEOCRACY!!!
by Mikkey Moouse on Jun 17, 2007 10:44 PM Permalink
increasing numbers purely by reproduction does not seem a very intelligen idea. thats why muslims communities are backward in all aspects throughout the world compared to the others.
Indeed 95% of Indian Muslims were Sanathanis (Hindus) who were forcibly converted by sword or lured for a better life. What has happened is happened.
They should understand that Islam is a religion that was created in Arab in a period when there was incessant wars and drought in that area. The codecs of Islam might be appropriate for that period and land and not for a country like Bharath which has been inhabited for millions years.
True that Indian muslims contribute a lot for the economy and growth of the country; It will be good if all of the Muslims feel that they have a tradition of milllion years' culture and should take the good things from Islam, instead of following it by books....
RE:Good start
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:19 PM Permalink
Hello Sir would you be king enough to tell on the forum from where you are quoting the figure that conversion to Islam in India was 95% based on sword .Are there any neutral sourcess or you are just quoting based on the usual feeling amongst all. And yar just one thing I wonder y the muslims failed to convert the rest of population of the subcontinent as they were all powerfull and mighty with their sword for hundreds of years.... The fact of the matter is these mughals are taken by us the representative of Muslims however they do not have any merits to represent Islam .Islam primarily and most Primarily forbids the formation of Rulers and Empires amongst people
RE:Good start
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:37 PM Permalink
No Sir please tell me which neutral source have you quoted your figure of 95 from? Belive me most of live by perceptions only....and as you are suggesting me to revise history ...I tell you somethings about history as well ..Never Understand History on the face value of figures without gaining a perspective of the times in your mind. You must be knowing History is something most manipulated by the winner of different times.SO we need to gain a deeper analysis and reach to a perspective while reading history...Well to simplify it goes like this the story of Indian freedom movement is different in our books then what you will read in the british records...The freedom fighters were terrorist for them...Yet the desription of events on part of both the countries is true to its people...So hopefully I am able to make a point about understnading History...Thnks
Same as you said, what is neutral for me is biased for you and what is biased for me may be neutral for you....So what is the yard stick of neutrality...?
RE:Good start
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:56 PM Permalink
Well thanks that U agreed to the point that there can be dual perspective and I as a personal rule for yardstick never use the number game like 95% because You know numbers have a magical effect on a neutral mind they have the power to devlop views without gaining a perspective...so I guess the best is we can have our views but shouldnt be reading much from numbers without a perspective....and neither should be quoting them...
For the yardstick well again the first step would be to behave in a more responsible way rather then reading from numbers ...to gain truer points from history....
RE:Good start
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:37 PM Permalink
Just look htru the history, how many temples were demolished and how many innocents were slaughtered near Kashi and Dwaraka, when the Turkish forces Invaded these cities. Any idea how many captured "hindu" Prisoners of war were killed by Akbar (the most secular mughal king)...Any idea how many Hindus converted due to the burden of Jazia on them...Mughals cant convert the rest of the country becuz of many reasons like the Might of Marathas, Sikhs etc., also they couldnt cross Vindhya to reach south India in those days, and when they did it, by that time and Portugese, the French and the English have checked them....
RE:Good start
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:43 PM Permalink
Well still no reference to your quote of 95% conversion on sword .... from any neutral source!! its the same perception on a particular hostoric account....
RE:Good start
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 11:09 PM Permalink
Hi..there is no figurative yardstick here ....rather matter of understanding the issue from different perspective ...I felt your quoting of 95% figure will definetely add to my knowledge if from a neutral source else it just a common mans perception..as told to him....by the system around...
RE:Good start
by imam on Jun 17, 2007 11:22 PM Permalink
Muslims failed to convert the entire sub continent because of Shivaji Rajputs Sikhs Krishnadeva raya Gurkhas Ahoms Nagas and many more Once the paki Auranzeb started his policy of forcible conversions, the hindus fought bcak and within 5 decades the Mughal emire was uprooted,from them on the muslims are on the run in India, latest glorious episode being the run in Kargil and the surrender of 90,000 soldiers in Bangladesh
RE:RE:Good start
by Silver on Jun 18, 2007 12:10 AM Permalink
I really wanted to laugh on your knowledge about history and geopgraphy !!!!
All Hindus are like you, uneducated???
All above name which you said like shivaj, rajput.... all these people are like mouse, aginst Lion (Aurangzeb).... And you said after 5 decades the muguhal empire was uprooted, then why did you accept Bahadurshah zafar as empire of Hindustan in 1857 gadar?
RE:WW-III
by Sameer Pawar on Jun 17, 2007 10:19 PM Permalink
what the bullshit!!! I am not Muslim, but I am nationalist. comments and thinking like yours is definitely anti-national. I have many muslim friends and I do not find any wrong with them. remember religion is a morphin which blinds your rational thinking. muslims are humans too. I agree there are muslims terrorists but then there are hindus also like naxalites and ULFA. all these people need to be dealt with affirmatived action. If they are wrong they should be dealt hard way. If theie grievances are right they it should be handled except demand for separate land. what we lack is clear nationalistic view irrespective of religion. u may say I am pro muslim, but I would say we should make laws strict for illegal immegrants. deport them, put them in jail as per law, do not allow them to work as per law. i hope you get my thoughts...
RE:RE:WW-III
by subbu on Jun 17, 2007 10:33 PM Permalink
Hey sameer, Naxalites and ulfa are not fighting under religious banner and in fact religion hardly matters for them.To compare them with muslim goondas hows your bankruptcy of thoughts!
RE:WW-III
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:34 PM Permalink
Good Sameer...I do accpet that there are ULFa and Naxals. But they dont fight in the name of religions. They dont wage wa against one particular religion. On the contrary they are ateist, they dont belive in God, there are fool who simply oppose any govt., that is all. But you see the case of Jihadis by urself.
I dont mind you reported my post as an abuse; it is your prerogative that the forum board ha given you. I have nothing against Muslims and I just wrote what I felt...
" You wrote what u felt" not a reasonable way.....a lot many people do that and end up maligning there cause ..see Osama he did wat he felt was right answer to american presence in the Gulf region....He has his point of view in that sense isnt it!!! but is that OK!!
RE:WW-III
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:02 PM Permalink
hmm u wish a lot Sri but its all dream ....Wiping out of Islam and Arab muslims feeling the evil ..(How do u know that??)
RE:WW-III
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:04 PM Permalink
Becuz, I have lot of Arab Muslim friends who are trying to come out of Islam....They are trying to be secular and no-alligned to Islam...
RE:WW-III
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:14 PM Permalink
Hmm I agree that the sample I have is too low to come to a conclusion. But I am seeing what is happening around me Ali. For example let us take Iran. I have many Iranian friends; inclusing my professor.
When there was a bomb blast in Delhi on the eve of Deepawali, I was really upset and when told this to my supervisor, he asked this question to me "Are Muslims resposible for this disgusting act"? I think you can derive conclusions from this. Atleast 75% of Iranians dont want to call themselves Muslims, but their govt will literally kill them (by Law of Shariat) if they convert.
The case is same with My Iraqi friends...I hope my guess may not be accurate but sure it is correct,,,,
RE:WW-III
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:31 PM Permalink
Hi Sri , Still what you are quoting is the common perception and not the feeling of an average muslim about his religion and how he feels the question of abandoning faith at mass level cant be justified by the fact the local governements are not giving them freedom .Belive me many of your frnds might want to live in a different system of governance but still wont leave ISLAM.
RE:WW-III
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:13 PM Permalink
Unfortuantely Islam has second largest following as a religion next to christians ..hence the obvious conflict with the west..and inspite of all this christian population in west is going down and muslim percentage increasing !!! per all the figures ...and by the way who has told you muslim are not secuarist...
RE:WW-III
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 10:25 PM Permalink
yar if u already knew there are secular muslims then y r u preddicting that Islam will be wiped out!! and I agree the muslim internal growth is the primary reason for the being highest growing religion ...but the regions where muslims are growing more are again like Indian Subcontinent where in not only muslims but others have always maintained a relatively higher growth rate compared to the world average always...PLS note even today there are more muslims liveing in the Indian Subcontinet (India Bangladesh Pakistan) then the middle east... there is more regional aspects with the issue then just garbling it with the name of religion....Please check the population growth of middle eastern countries ..its no where compared to India , Pak , Bangladesh....
RE:RE:WW-III
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:17 PM Permalink
There are Secular Muslims indeed and I know many such..... ....By the way, the increase in Muslim population is not due to conversion from other faiths....but it is due to that fact that muslims reproduce more than others. They dont have the concept of birth control....as you would already know...
RE:America's defeat in Iraq will lead to Al Qaeda's conquest of the world
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 09:54 PM Permalink
If it Alquida is going to open an a/c in Bharath, they will be given a good and fitting reply....Dont have ur own imaginations.....terrrorists will never earn human heart..
RE:America's defeat in Iraq will lead to Al Qaeda's conquest of the world
by Ali Mirza on Jun 17, 2007 09:58 PM Permalink
hmmm well the war in iraq was created by americans to steer away the jihadi focus from there homeland ...i think americans are intelligent enough in policies and warfare....no need to worry about a global Osmaa effect Mr robin hood because not all muslims are osama and neither Osama represents all muslims..
RE:America's defeat in Iraq will lead to Al Qaeda's conquest of the world
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:19 PM Permalink
True that America is intelligent....and their war in Middle east is to gain the Oil from ME. Once the oil is drained or if world could find an alternative energy, then things will start changing....
RE:WHY BLAME AMERICA?
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 09:58 PM Permalink
Islam is not uprising....dont have an illusion. The increase in muslim population is not becuz people convert to islam, but muslims reproduce more....which will soon be reduced....wait and see buddy...Islam cant survive 21st century
RE:Persectuion of the righteous has existed since beginning of mankind
by S Narain on Jun 17, 2007 10:59 PM Permalink
pakistan has been US ally since inception i.e last 50 years . You would never say that Pakistan was a stooge of US for last 50 years. Why people like you never raised such question for last 50 years. It is just convinient for you to talk like this and use the billions of $s of arms and aid from America by countries like Pakistan. You dont seem to be Indian Muslim,by the way.
RE:Persectuion of the righteous has existed since beginning of mankind
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 09:51 PM Permalink
Are to trying to say Osama is a righteous person? Osama is not only enemy of U.S but for Bharath also.....mind it....
RE:Persectuion of the righteous has existed since beginning of mankind
by Dalit King on Jun 17, 2007 10:10 PM Permalink
Do You think america is friend of BHARATH..Noo..remember BRITISHERS..They brought Multi National Companies to BHARATH..and occupied BHARATH..they made BHARATHIYA as slaves.Americans are doing the same thing..and in 20 years BHARATH will be again in Americans control ..and BHARATH a slave countries..and your children will curse AMERICA..
RE:Persectuion of the righteous has existed since beginning of mankind
by Srivatsan Rajagopalan on Jun 17, 2007 10:07 PM Permalink
Indded Al-Quida is not righteous party....Not becuz they attacked America, but they attack innocent people all over the world.....
