RE:indian economy overheating
by hello on Feb 11, 2007 04:06 AM Permalink
People use our openness & using it aganist us. Nothing big is there, it is common in all countries. Of course, poverty should be eliminated. Even if it is eliminated, because of openness, you can find even one person out of a 1.2b & it will be posted somewhere.
India should reform ONLY things that PROFITS INDIA not whatever WTO or world bank or IMF dictate. Understand this , unless India defends its Interests against tools of neo-colonialism like WTO, WB, IMF India will not benefit at large , yes top 1-2% will make billions (Also Known As neo-colonial enablers) . After last colonial era, west realized that having colonies mean they could be held responsible for the welfare of people that live in their colonies. So they created a new world order where through trade laws that are created to benefit mainly the western countries via their puppets in AKA friendly regimes, created in former colonies will take the fall while they take the profits. This is very transparent in country where raw material is what 1st world seeks, but in India and China where populations output is the resource AKA cheap labor , laws are being put in place like technology transfer restrictions, almost perpetual patents , and fooling India to adopt laws that benefit the west in the long run at Indias expense. These western MBA graduates etc.. students are basically taught concepts that will enable neo-colonialism , so these Indian students learn concepts that will make them setup up neo-colonialism structure while they think they are benefiting their country. After the structure in in place at 80-20 profit ratio, 80% profit for west 20% for their enablers NEW COLONY is SET. So think and doubt every advice that comes out of the western or western trained business economic consultants mouth, to check IN short and long run WHO makes more profit. China has played it smart so far India I am not so sure. One other nugget .. Never give up nukes under any pretext latest deliverable nukes and related military is the other side of economic coin. One day unjust trade laws will come to a head then gun-boat diplomacy starts that%u2019s what those are for.
RE:my 2 cents about new world order and India
by Kirti Shetty on Feb 12, 2007 01:04 PM Permalink
This shows people like you have no idea of economics or how countries/economies should be run... All people bashing reforms, please tell me... what benefit did India get by being closed to reforms all these years??? Did the poor get rich then??? Face it guys, India was on the brink of bankruptcy and we have seen all this prosperity only after the reforms... People respect India in the software world... only after the reforms... so don't blame without having any sense about economics... When reforms happen, there is pain... and it takes time for the fruits to trkle down... and for all you guys playing the China card and blowing China's trumpet... China is more open than India is... China is committed to reforms... and China is reforming at a rate faster than India... India started in 1991, where China started reforms in 1979... so you saw that prosperity reaching the Chinese now... only in last 10 years... For all you critics, if you want to see the effect of reforms in India... see telecom... we have the cheapest telecom rates in the world... and that because of the increased competition and abolition of state owned monopolies due to the reforms in telecom.... Politicians till date fool people abt reforms... and people like you are fooled... Its proven firms like Walmart improve standard of living for people... Imagine you can buy more stuff with Rs 100 then you benefit too... and the common man has been duped all these years by paying higher price for the same goods... So, please get you basics right... before you speak...
RE:RE:my 2 cents about new world order and India
by amit singhvi on Feb 13, 2007 03:25 PM Permalink
I totally agree with you. Every policy will have its pros and cons. But this gives fair competition and make indian companies more competitive. Its the survival of the fittest.
RE:my 2 cents about new world order and India
by Yogi on Feb 11, 2007 04:50 PM Permalink
Interesting observation...I liked this one : "After last colonial era, west realized that having colonies mean they could be held responsible for the welfare of people that live in their colonies. So they created a new world order where through trade laws that are created to benefit mainly the western countries via their puppets in AKA friendly regimes"..HAHA
DESPERATE 85% of people in India are desperate working slaves in an informal economy and their lives oscillate between fear and frustration.
EVEN MORE DESPERATE The remaining High Net Worth Individuals in India are always in search of collusion mostly in the form of caste to enhance their wealth.
SOLUTION A credible minimum income guaranteed system for every one whether they work or not will bring in dignity instead of desperation for the working poor and inheritance taxes will stimulate compassion instead of collusion.
Such system will prevent all socioeconomic issues in India viz farmer suicides, dowry deaths, child labor, fear, frustration, corruption, bribery, prostitution, terrorism etc.
RE:India
by Maximus Decimus Meridius on Feb 10, 2007 12:43 PM Permalink
"SOLUTION A credible minimum income guaranteed system for every one whether they work or not will bring in dignity instead of desperation for the working poor and inheritance taxes will stimulate compassion instead of collusion.
Such system will prevent all socioeconomic issues in India viz farmer suicides, dowry deaths, child labor, fear, frustration, corruption, bribery, prostitution, terrorism etc."
Such a system exists. It's called communism. It has failed miserably. Socialism is dying too... The most steadfast of socialists, France is coming to realize that socialism can do only so much (They have more unemployment than US!).
A point to consider is that in Western Europe (France Germany etc), the fact that the state takes care of its citizens results in armies of people who would make minimum wage in the free market to not attempt to get a job and live off the state's funding. (If you make the same whether you work or not, would you work?)
RE:RE:India
by m sasikala on Feb 12, 2007 06:20 PM Permalink
I would appreciate if you propose a alternative solution to "prevent all socioeconomic issues in India viz farmer suicides, dowry deaths, child labor, fear, frustration, corruption, bribery, prostitution, terrorism etc."
RE:RE:RE:India
by YuanKush on Feb 13, 2007 12:11 AM Permalink
Put those people in Prison except the first one. Frustration can happen even in people those who have million dollars when they couldn't buy another company. Farmers suicide can be prevented by regulation & middle man avoidance & using technological alternatives, subsidy in their loans etc. Prostitution can be regulated by legalizing it. Ctrl Child labor by making mandatory education.
Both man mohan and PC are incomepetent and psuedo experts.Merely working or studying in USA does not make one superior or more capable.They have misplaced notions of development and economics.Both of them are miserable failures.They jhave made copmmon man's life hell and living difficult with average price rise 15-20% per annum since last few years.open loot an dplunder is going on in economy.Huge taxes have been levied in various forms.propeety prices have sky rocketed besides prices of vegetables and commidities. The brainless and fraudulent expert that MM is,he fails to understand that India does not need schemes like SEZs.The earlier ones too are failures.Same way big retail chains, home grown or foreign are detrimental to property prices and also to small retailers across the country.It is going to cause a havoc in society in few years from now. Mr Manmohan and PC both should be removed immediately. Goverenment should focus imediately on arresting price rise of real estate and its roll back, reducing retail level infaltion to 4-5 % maximum,moderating taxes imposed on people and generate employment. The common man's life till then will turn for worse
RE:Economic reforms and Manmohan Singh
by Maximus Decimus Meridius on Feb 10, 2007 01:00 PM Permalink
What a load of bull this is. Just putting a Prof in front of your name doesnt make you an expert. Which brilliant university do you come from or work at? Do you even have a PhD? (I doubt, and if so, you are not supposed to use the title Prof without a PhD). Manmohan singh graduated from the London School of Economics and PC from Harvard, both #1 and #2 economic schools in the world. Manmohan Singh was the head of RBI as a bureaucrat before he joined politics. For your information PC reduced income taxes to max slab of 30% when he was the finance minister the first time. Before that it was ~40/50%. Average price increase of 15-20% per annum in the last few years? Are you high? Inflation in India hasn't crossed 5% in the last few years. In fact it's been at that level even when BJP were in power. SEZs are failures? Wow, sir, you are quite astute, I must say. China's economy runs only on SEZs and you, in all your wisdom have concluded that SEZs dont work. SEEPZ is an SEZ in Bombay, and it's been hugely successful even before economic reforms. What has failed is India's socialistic model. 50 years of socialism has been about making it hard for anyone to make money, so that economic disparities are minimized. Socialism in India was more about impoverishing the rich than enriching the poor. We took this cap off and see where Infy, TCS, Wipro, Tata have reached. And this is only the beginning...
India's tax levels are lower than they've ever been so dont make stuff up. Finally "Goverenment should focus imediately on arresting price rise of real estate and its roll back, reducing retail level infaltion to 4-5 % maximum,moderating taxes imposed on people and generate employment. ", you said. Inflation is 4-5%. Taxes are low-moderate, if you compare it to pre liberalization India. How can the government have low taxes and generate employment at the same time? Where does the capital to generate employment come from? If you run the economy on a deficit, doesnt your inflation go up, "professor"?
RE:RE:Economic reforms and Manmohan Singh
by amit singhvi on Feb 13, 2007 03:32 PM Permalink
Hi Maximus, I enkoyed your bashing :) It was good and impressed with your precise answer..
RE:Economic reforms and Manmohan Singh
by nickel biswas on Feb 12, 2007 12:21 AM Permalink
Do you know why there are price rises? Partly, it is because of the increased cost of oil, which is beyond the PMs control. But, it is also due to 2 other factors: 1) The high level of public debt in india. The banks have to put all their resources into financing the HUGE govt debt, instead of financing loans for the common man. This leads to higher interest rates for businesses, individuals and farmers; which is an extra cost that they pass on the the consumers. If you want to blame someone for this then blame the left front because they spend so much money on wastful programs like the job guarantee act, most of which goes into the pockets of politicians.
2) Lack of infrastructure. Economic growth, like the kind India is experiencing, will stimulate increased demand as people have more money to spend. But, if there is not a corresponding increase in supply to balance this demand, then the prices will naturally go up. If you want to blame someone for this then blame the left front; almost every attempt to build infrastructure and factories are met by protests by the left front.
As long as corruption is there country will grow %u2026 Our country is growing just by bribing. Any thing can be done by bribing our leaders. What we have is handicapped system. No way %u2026dude %u2026 you have to fight or bribe to grow.
These government reforms will make middle class to rich, rich to Politician, poor to beggar, beggar to terrorist. Reforms need to come from society and naturally. No body will bother if we start mall in my place with my own money. If govt allows some rich outsider to start a very biiiiig mall then, we need beg in front of his mall.
Take look at this cruel way of forming SEZs .. Suppose a SEZ will be allotted to place called A. The land market price in A is: 1,00,000 and govt price is: 30,000 Our leaders will come to know abt this SEZ before announcement to public and buy land over there. Then the price will shoot up to 2 L Then govt will start acquire land from farmers but not from politicians for suppose 1.5 L (which is very rare case.) The point to note is the farmer is not interested to sell his cultivating land becos this life for him. But he has no choice. Now govt will sell this land to companies for 4 L So the market price in surrounding area will be 4 to 5 L may be 10L
Now the farmer who has 1.5 L will do now??? He won%u2019t get any land around 60 km radius of SEZ or his Hut. So he has to get out his village and find a place where get land for 1.5 L. or has to beg at traffic lights. Unplanned reforms like SEZs will further destroy the country.
See the other side of the coin %u2026 SEZ will come %u2026people who have lands around SEZ will become rich and richer. Jobs will come in 10-15 yrs time and some people will get befits out of it. But %u2026.
THE RICH WILL BE SAFE ONLY WHEN THE POOR IS HAPPY
So try to eradicate poor than make rich to richer %u2026
RE:Economic Reforms
by hanif mohammed on Feb 09, 2007 11:26 PM Permalink
Well, you tell which came first - chicken or egg ? Someone got to make the sacrifice at the begining for well being of future generations. If one go by your theory, we will never make any development. SEZ's are great opportunity to a country, and brings in innovations and employment for millions. As you say, there will be corrupt politicians who take advantage of such siutations, but atleast we are not a stagnant economy (I do not justify corruption, but its a contagious system we have to live with).
RE:RE:Economic Reforms
by Durga Thumati on Feb 09, 2007 11:53 PM Permalink
I am not against of SEZ%u2019s which are must for developing country like India. But the way govt grabbing land from farmers is wrong. Land acquisition need to do reasonably by the private companies but not Govt. The farmers must have share on the company which is starting at his place. (All matter is the LAND)
India reached this stage with out SEZ%u2019s. I don%u2019t know how many companies will come in these SEZ%u2019s in the near future but Govt doing real estate business in the name of SEZ%u2019s which is not good for poor.
RE:RE:RE:Economic Reforms
by hello on Feb 11, 2007 04:02 AM Permalink
If we introduce new new problems like this, then how we get SEZ & develop our infrastructure Others are stepping up BPO, so, some how, we need to figure out way to step up our process to implement the SEZs. They are vital for countries economic progress. When we tell about other countries economic growth, we are very easy to tell that that country has this much SEZ, this much this & this much that. But when developing our country the same thing why do we face all this problems.
RE:Economic Reforms
by on Feb 18, 2007 12:30 AM Permalink
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Our PM is an economic genius. Not vote catcher. No body can contain the reforms. It is not our babus' idea but the big power's pressure. The influence of the Nehru family is immense. Rahul will be unstoppable once he is out. Prianka no doubt shall steal all the votes. It is their life to decide what and what not to do.
Once I am an admirer of Narshimha rao and Manmohan who by their economical reforms in early 90%u2019s gave life to dying Indian economy. Most of our current economical glory is the out come of their vision a decade back. But the way the Narshimha rao life ended is pure pitty, the agony of Sonia not even allowed his last rites to be done properly, Manmohan is also going to face the fate the day he rejects Sonia. He knows that well.
Let us hope at these economic reforms will continue and helps our country to grow to sustainable development.
Jaihind.
I am only supporting Narshimha rao from the fact that he is dare enough to bring revolutionary economic changes with such a wrapper thin majority in parliament. For all other ills to which he is directly/indirectly responsible are immaterial here.
RE:Economic Reforms
by anuj agarwal on Feb 09, 2007 10:09 PM Permalink
Narsimha Rao was a great politician and national hero.
The curse of this country is nehru-gandhi dynasty and their sycophants 'DARBARIS' like Arjun Singh who actually colluded with Britishers and now also enjoying all the good things and power.
RE:RE:Economic Reforms
by pradeep kumar on Feb 11, 2007 12:22 AM Permalink
Agreed. It is an open secret that India is in the S**t hole because of the Nehru-Gandhi clan (they are not a dynasty!!!). Many thought that India is on its way to prosperity after Rajeev Gandhi was taken out by the LTTE(which is a terrorist group and should be disarmed). I was never a fan of the BJP but on further analysis being a nationalistic party (their Hinduism and Ram-ism not withstanding) they might want to see India as a true developed country.
Manmohan and PC both eminently educated and with great track record may perform much better without S*** Ganghi's and communists frequent meddling. Millions of peoples hopes were dashed when VP Singh drove our country further into the ditch with backward looking policies.
One thing is for sure, unless there is a great amount of investment in our education systems complete with primary education and world class universities (not IITs. IITs are nothing but a human kiln. ie. talent in - talent out) with education access to the entire spread of society India is not going anywhere. If there is no strong foundation the building will eventually crumble.
RE:RE:Economic Reforms
by rajat samanta on Feb 09, 2007 11:28 PM Permalink
well said anuj agarwal u r so rite. but the problem is not with you and me the problem is the masses(idiots) and women (bigger idiots)who lick the dynasty arse.
Economic reforms are here to stay. Indian economy needs to generate savings and capital. Socialism and communism have failed. They pushed the country backwards by 50 years. We need transparency in public services and policy implementation. Politicians hate transparency and literacy. It robs them of their gimmicks and livelihood. Free enterprise promotes efficiency. Job security mars the enterprise. Those who talk against acquiring land for sez or industrialization, they are only blind to the fact that the pieces of land holding, generated only partial employment and contributed to emotional immobility. Lack of education is the root cause of all the ills in our society. If industrial houses who are granted land are thrust with social responsibility, matter could change for better. Capital when deployed would naturally generate employment and savings and benefit the locals.
The reforms process has unleashed forces that are truly gigantic. Whether these forces will ultimately bring about prosperity to the vast millions,only time will tell. There is no doubt that it will bring a lot of pain and suffering to millions of people and specifically those forming the votebanks. Mr Manmohan Singh began unshackling the economy from stifling administrative controls.The market forces have wrought changes which cannot be reversed. Neither the Bureaucracy, nor the Political parties have shown the will or even the inclination to control these forces.That the fall out may turnout to be disastrous for millions does not seem to bother them. The farmers suicides happening regularly is one sign. The cult of indebtedness on a massive scale is being promoted on a largely unsuspecting population. The SEZ has been the latest face of the market reform and is proceeding at a frenetic pace and all political parties want to exploit it. But this time round the political parties have to face those very votebanks that they have cultivated for their survival. Rightly or wrongly the very same Mr Manmohan Singh who had been lionised for his bold initiatives will have to face the wrath of a backlash. There is no doubt that there will be a backlash and the canny politicians are only preparing an escape route by making the PM responsible for the Punjab elections. The PM will also play along as the outcome of the Punjab poll is inconsequential as far as he is concerned.
