The left is opposing this deal only on ideological grounds - the left is anti US. They are opposing not because the deal could harm India's long term interest.Their decision is not based on what is good or bad for India but based on what is good for their party's survival. So in short comies are selfish towards their ideology even at the cost of India's benefit. The lalus and Pawars and others in the coalition are not with Manmohansingh because they do not have the guts to face an early election now ( in case commies pull the govt down). These coalition partners are selfish too like commies- selfish and greedy for power. Certainly India's interests are not included in their decision making process ( I am neither saying nuclear deal is beneficial for India nor I am against it for the reason that I do not know exact implication of this deal - some of which would become clear only after it is and if it is implemented). I am more concerned about the decision making process of the coalition partners in UPA. None of them have India's interest in mind - though they are taking great pains to make it seem as if they have only India's interest on mind. As for BJP - it does not influence over the outcome of this deal and its opinion on this issue does not really matter.... so they are doing what any 'opposition' would do - oppose it for the heck of it..then bring out arguements supporting the stand...India Shining ?
Solar and Wind energy, if promoted by the GOVERNMENT properly can fulfil every requirement. The money which we are investing in Nuclear reactors and Hydroelectricity etc. should be diverted in form of SUBSIDIES to the LARGE SCALE promotion of renewable sources of energy. Otherwise all our slogans on environmenmtal conservation will be slogans only. And I request readers to do some more research before writing anything against any idea. Why do we see everything so negatively? To quote a report by Rob Edwards published in "The New Scientist" , 10th June 2006 (Magazine issue 2555),"In the mountain village of Kara Agach in Kyrgyzstan, people are unwittingly eating radioactive waste. Radium left behind by more than two decades of uranium mining during the Soviet era has contaminated their chickens,milk, potatoes and pears." THIS IS JUST ONE EXAMPLE.... Till what time will we live in stone age? Everything must be decided on the merits and demerits & on purely scientific grounds. What is the point in ignoring the freely available energy and kissing the death? If we could start to see the things in more correct light, we can save our nature from more extinction. With warm regards, Chetan Upadhyaya, Satya Foundation
RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by Rakesh Bhandary on Dec 05, 2007 01:09 AM Permalink
"Radium left behind by more than two decades of uranium "...... Which equation or reaction states this? Nuclear power is reliable, especially when India needs it in this period of economic boom. Wind power is highly subject to climatic changes and the amount of power needed in India means that there is not enough steel to manufacture this number of wind turbines. In long term, we have to focus on alternative forms of energy but the need now is for more power without increasing greenhouse gas output. Believe me, this greenhouse gas issue will be used as a pretext by western powers to pull our progress down.
CPI(M) or BJP does not give a toss to the real issues. Had BJP been in power and suggested this deal, Congress would have opposed it!
Long live Indian politics.... our bane and an international humiliation.
So please get your nuclear physics correct before quoting some unknown person in an unknown magazine!!
RE:RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by pragya nopany on Dec 05, 2007 02:07 AM Permalink
It is really pathetic that no one is pointing towards the REAL target. To me, FOSSIL FUEL, HYDROELECTRCITY & NUCLEAR ENERGY- are the 3 biggest demons and anybody supporting them is actually killing the planet. The big question is: Why nuclear when it can't give more than 6% of our total energy needs(and that too by 2020)? How long will we bear the the bruises of ignorance and slavery? There is something terribly wrong with the mindset of our leadership and the people. Everybody knows that the NUCLEAR WASTE MANAGEMENT is IMPOSSIBLE, but still we Indians continue to give logic in favour of the Nuclear energy. US has not built even a single nuclear reactor after 1979 and wants to sell us the 'rejected and HAZARDOUS technology'. And we have closed our eyes and proving our 'progressive attitude' by singing songs of praise for the Nuclear energy. Have we gone really mad? As Mr. Lakshman Singh of BJP pointed out in LOKSABHA on 28th November, 2007, there is only one safe, economical and the best way to all our energy needs: Solar and Wind energy. To quote Mr. Chetan Upadhyaya of SATYA FOUNDATION, "If at all, we want to save the world from further environmental degradation, WE MUST ADOPT SOLAR & WIND POWER, NOW. Otherwise all our slogans on Environment will be slogans only." Will the people cool down and listen the truth Or continue to be slaves? PRAGYA
RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by SATYA FOUNDATION on Dec 05, 2007 01:36 AM Permalink
You go to google.com get not one but many such results; not only in one place or country, but at many places...And you are doubtful about Wind energy without caring to know that there are many states where you get enough wind throughout the year. So, please get ur GK corrected. And u have not mentioned solar, whereas Solar energy is one field where we can be super power. Boss, may be u r some 'progressive citizen', who is ardent lover of nuclear physics, but you must appreciate that Google has recently entered the field of Solar energy by collaborating with Nanosolar. The idea of your Nuclear energy may be very good for a small country, but for a big country like India, tapping the renewable sources of energy is the best option. And in case, you are still unsatisfied with the reply, you can mail me for getting detailed data and comparative analysis with concrete Statistics. Actually, it is not the problem with you, but many 'great and intellectual' people that they tend to forget that 'Progress is the realisation of Utopias'. Getting energy from Sun and wind may appear to be utopian idea, but remember, only they are going to save our planet from more degradation. And why to throw mud on other countries for green house emissions, when we ourselves are making the environment so 'clean'? The contribution of Nuclear energy in total energy scenario is 3% and by all means you can't go beyond 6-7% and that too by 2020. SO THINK SOLAR/WIND/RENEWABLE RESOURCES. Chetan Upadhyaya
RE:RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by Rakesh Bhandary on Dec 05, 2007 08:35 PM Permalink
Probably the computer you are using is powered by electricity generated by fossil fuel (or maybe nuclear depending on your locality). Please read my message again, I have mentioned nuclear energy for the moment, and alternative in long term. It is our own fault that GOI's planning commission initially pegged at nuclear output at 25% of electricity production but as our other projects did not live upto it. According to World Energy Forum in 2005, your photovoltic electricity and wind power accounts for 0.42% and 4.58% of renewable energy output respectivley. Large and small hydro-electricity projects account for 63% of renewable energy production. India's hydroelectricity production is 33GW only, though it's potential is 20 times this amount. But we have already seen the time wasted due to protests over Narmada project.
So please get your facts right, instead of asking me to read up google.com (which gives out lot of unsubstantiated nonsense!). Google is not a panacea for all issues.
And again, to produce the amount of electricity we need from wind and solar energy, we will have to invest an unimaginable amount (and it won't be sufficient).
If you are a practical person, please practice what you have written here & give up fossil fuel driven vehicle, install solar panels on ur roof and a wind turbine AND cut-off your electricity supply.
And by the way, please tell me how radium is formed from uranium?
RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by Bhupendra Singh on Dec 05, 2007 01:45 AM Permalink
How do u see Nuclear energy as the reliable option in this era of economic boom? In which country do you live Mr. Rakesh Bhandary? It seems that you don't read newspapers and magazines. Even in the parliament, we heard that day that Nuclear energy, if developed on a war-footing basis (read very large scale, even after the proposed India-US nuclear deal can't give more than 7 percent of our total National energy needs. And by optimistic means, reaching this level may only be possible by the year 2020. And the risks involved in it are still very high. Even our Nuclear scientists (read Indian scientists) are divided over this issue. So, why can't we harness the required power from Solar, Wind, biomass and other sources of Renewable energy? Bhupendra Singh
RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by Rakesh Bhandary on Dec 05, 2007 07:13 PM Permalink
I live in a real world Mr B Singh. Probably the computer you are using is powered by electricity generated by fossil fuel (or maybe nuclear depending on your locality). Please read my message again, I have mentioned nuclear energy for the moment, and alternative in long term. It is our own fault that GOI's planning commission initially pegged at nuclear output at 25% of electricity production but as our other projects did not live upto it. According to World Energy Forum in 2005, your photovoltic electricity and wind power accounts for 0.42% and 4.58% of renewable energy output respectivley. Large and small hydro-electricity projects account for 63% of renewable energy production. India's hydroelectricity production is 33GW only, though it's potential is 20 times this amount. But we have already seen the time wasted due to protests over Narmada project.
So please get your facts right, instead of asking me to read up google.com (which gives out lot of unsubstantiated nonsense!). Google is not a panacea for all issues.
If you are really into practicing what you talk, don't use a fuel driven vehicle, install solar panel on roof-top and wind turbine & severe your electricity connection. And please ask Satya foundation, how radium appears from Uranium!
RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by Bhupendra Singh on Dec 06, 2007 12:57 AM Permalink
Why are u complicating the simple matter? You want to show and prove that u are Nuclear physicist. Accepted. What next? Tell me just one point: you want government to continue with Nuclear energy, coal and fossil fuel OR WANT EVERYONE TO COME UP WITH SOLAR, WIND AND BIOMASS energy? You want to kill the humanity or save it by adopting green energy? Remember, if we don't adopt renewable sources of energy now, our children will never forgive us. So instead of challenging the science community, please correct ur facts and read latest magazines. For your kind information. Google has collaborated with Nanosolar for implemenmting the idea of Solar power and making it a ground reality. So u r progressive physicist or the one who will think of Solar and wind energy in 2040? I am sorry but don't be so pessimistic Sir; be OPTIMISTIC.
RE:Why are parties silent on Subsidies to RENEWABLE energy sector?
by Rakesh Bhandary on Dec 10, 2007 11:10 PM Permalink
"Why are u complicating the simple matter?".... If this matter is as simple as you suggest, why the hell are we discussing this like mad hatters?? And again, I suggest you read my comments thoroughly. I have said (once again) 'nuclear power for the time being, and alternative sources in the long run'.
Could you also tell me where have I mentioned the use of fossil fuels and coal? This is where I have specifically mentioned that India for the time being will have to go for nuclear power (& not coal & fossil fuel powered electricity stations) as western powers have already started pestering India (and China) regarding greenhouse emissions, and this will be a determining factor in future to our economy. In future, if thorium research ever is successful, it will replace uranium & India will be a power surplus country. I would like to see what the wise guys in this forum have to say then.
So, please take your juvenile comments somewhere esle if you do not understand the gravity of the situation. Don't talk about 2040, when the need is now!!!
Just out of interest, how much solar, wind and biomass energy are you using instead of fossil fuel currently?
COI: I drive a biogas-powered car (not LPG or CNG).
No Deal with US is a Deal in true sense. And they would not need a Hyde Act to deny us the full extent of the fruit of the Deal. If they need to dishonour any part of the Deal, they can do it any time by simply passing an amendment. Even that is also not required, if the US chose so. And no country in the world has the Strength to deny them that.
But it seems, we have no viable alternative. Unless we have the deal, we can not have dealings with other countries. No country can defy the US. We have to give the Lion's Share to the US. No way out.
The opposition by left parties is basically because th agreement is with US. The point is the agreement gives us a choice of building new plants etc and therefore we should go ahead nad create the choice. We have not yet developed the thorium based technology.We cannot work on the assumption that it will be a reality in the near future. The agreement does not prohibit us from developing this technolgy. The IPI pipeline assumes that we can get secured supplies via Pakistan. This is highly debatable because experience has shown that the Pakistan Government is highly unreliable.Further, even if we accept their assurances at face value, we still have the question regarding the capability to prevent terrorist attack. The problem with Nuclear technology is that mankind has no proper technology to handle the radio active wastes. However, we do not have a better solution today to sove our energy needs.
BJP wants UPA out of power so it is using CPI/Congress rift to bring down govt..
Commies want to dance to China Town so they do not want Congress to work out a deal with USA
OK Fine >>> But what about India's electricity needs when You can not go for coal based plants because of Global warming.
You can not go all out for OIL / Gas / Naphtha as Crude oil prices are jumping through roof.
Solar & Wind power are no answer to BASE LOAD electicity requirement and also are damn expensive.
Hydroelectricity is rain dependent as well as capital cost intensive only option is Arunachal Pradesh. All else is almost utilised. And you can not haul Arunachal Pradesh Hydro to Down south.
These politicians have really Killed the issue. They are wasting time.
Let Modren India face 20 Hours power cut in domestic supply Especially in New DELHI
RE:It is sad no one is looking towards India's Energy needs
by Rakesh Bhandary on Dec 05, 2007 01:14 AM Permalink
Hi... atleast one sane person in this discussion. Here's my reply to another wise guy from Satya Foundation... just pasting it here as well.
Radium left behind by more than two decades of uranium "...... Which equation or reaction states this? Nuclear power is reliable, especially when India needs it in this period of economic boom. Wind power is highly subject to climatic changes and the amount of power needed in India means that there is not enough steel to manufacture this number of wind turbines. In long term, we have to focus on alternative forms of energy but the need now is for more power without increasing greenhouse gas output. Believe me, this greenhouse gas issue will be used as a pretext by western powers to pull our progress down.
CPI(M) or BJP does not give a toss to the real issues. Had BJP been in power and suggested this deal, Congress would have opposed it!
Long live Indian politics.... our bane and an international humiliation.
So please get your nuclear physics correct before quoting some unknown person in an unknown magazine!!
And as far as solar power is concerned.... we will run out of sand to manufacture solar panel!!
RE:It is sad no one is looking towards India's Energy needs
by pragya nopany on Dec 04, 2007 09:59 PM Permalink
Very good issue,. well raised. Keep it up
