Hi Guys, I am new to this site - still trying to work it out.
The comment on:
Aug 30, 2007 10:24 PM
beginning:
"Justice V R Krishna's fears are well founded"
was from me. It seems I "ran out" of writing room, and more then a third of my message has been missed out - which was relevant. Hope you get the picture anyway of what I am trying to say. Thanks Pravin
Justice V R Krishna's fears are well founded, but needs to be debated as two different issues ie:
1. The N. deal is good for India - no doubt. "human hazards of radiation before.." - yes, but look at Bhopal, irresponsible oil & chemical installations pumping effluence into rivers and landfills, fertiliser in farms, fish dying in rivers etc - It must all be dealt with, or India will be left behind. India can cope with hazzad containment. The green lobby has an interest here too, and we must take heed.
2. "Among the grave dangers of the deal are the American inspections (of India's nuclear facilities), accessibility of dual use technology as well as the impact on independent foreign policy"
NOW, HERE, The Hon. Justice is SO right !!! HOWEVER...
I note some unkind words here directed at this judge. These are learned men, and they do not need to be scientists to understand the dangers.
India needs to make the coal and oil fired power stations redundant if it is to play its role in the international arena at the UN, WTO & NATO.
Wave, solar, hydro and wind energy is all good, but will not generate enough to power & sustain the booming economy (now under imminent danger and threat by notable increases of Islamic terrorists activities all over India - Hydrabad, Bangalore, Kerela etc. - another issue but relevant).
The nuclear plants are a necessity however objectionable they may be, if we are going to clean up the air you and I breath, so we stand up and be
Justice V R Krishna's fears are well founded, but needs to be debated as two different issues ie:
1. The N. deal is good for India - no doubt. "human hazards of radiation before.." - yes, but look at Bhopal, irresponsible oil & chemical installations pumping effluence into rivers and landfills, fertiliser in farms, fish dying in rivers etc - It must all be dealt with, or India will be left behind. India can cope with hazzad containment.
2. "Among the grave dangers of the deal are the American inspections (of India's nuclear facilities), accessibility of dual use technology as well as the impact on independent foreign policy"
NOW, HERE, The Hon. Justice is SO right !!! HOWEVER...
I note some unkind words here directed at this judge. These are learned men, and they do not need to be scientists to understand the dangers.
India needs to make the coal and oil fired power stations redundant if it is to play its role in the international arena at the UN, WTO & NATO.
Wave, solar, hydro and wind energy is all good, but will not generate enough to power & sustain the booming economy (now under imminent danger and threat by notable increases of Islamic terrorists activities all over India - Hydrabad, Bangalore, Kerela etc. - another issue but relevant).
The nuclear plants are a necessity however objectionable they may be, if we are going to clean up the air you and I breath, so we stand up and be counted at the UN assembly and Nato.
Whenever We trusted what we got in return: East India company: The slavery. Current brown sahibs. China: 1962 war and monkey (Pakistan) on the back. Bangladesh: Explosions. Bodo, Naga and other terrorism. Pakistan: War and Kargil and terrorism. Nepal: Anti-Indian riots. Shri Lanka: Untimely death of great Rajiv Gandhi Japan, Austrelia & South Africa: Their reaction after the nuclear tests were the uncivilized and insulting. Canada and USA: promoted Khalistani terrorism till 9/11. NAM countries: Never supported India during 1971 crisis and J&K related mater.
RE:Be careful
by mr on Aug 29, 2007 05:14 AM Permalink
So, don't consider anything as trust or harm. If there is some development or electricity out of that welcome that.
Look who is talking about wind power...a judge? what qualification does he have to say them? did he do research n found that we have abundant wind\solar energy? does it mean our so called scientist taht have been working on similar projects are fit for nothing guys? please allow lion n deer to do their jobs...don't interchnage, the repercussions could be bad... for example, this idoti judge is just looking for cheap publicity through sites like rediff...
RE:credential please???
by Lalatendu Deo on Aug 29, 2007 09:56 AM Permalink
What qualification did you have while commenting such? As you have every right to make a comment on something, he has every right to make his points through.
RE:credential please???
by Lucky B on Aug 29, 2007 04:39 AM Permalink
"idoti judge"? Are you qualified enough to comment on the judge or nuclear deal? Or is Mr. Manmohan Singhji nuclear scientist? At least you don't know how to comment without insulting someone.
RE:credential please???
by Ashutosh Kole on Aug 29, 2007 06:08 AM Permalink
India lies in the tropical belt. We have abundant Sun through out the year, through out the country. Why dont we explore Solar Energy? European Countries such as Germany, Sweden etc are going the Solar way even though they have a limited Sunny days and moreover they are not in the tropics. We have land, Sun. We can be self relient on energy and also spend MUCH less by going the Solar way. In this way we will also be far from the clutches of US and countries like Australia who we have to be dependent on to get Nuclear fuel. Nuclear energy and this deal totally does not make sense if we see other energy options like Solar or wind. If European countries can do it, we certainly can.
India values are enshrined in our Constitution's preamble of 1950. The values he seems to be subscribing here are those of Indian communists only.
The Wind and Tidal energy shall not be significant sources in near future. While France meets nearly 80% of its energy needs and Japan gets 30% of its total needs from nuclear. Mr. Iyer's analysis on technology policy needs is simply ridiculous.
His rabble rousing "...latently terrible for those who know Big Power stratagems" is quite unfortunate. We can not sacrifice Indian economic development needs just because the likes of Mr. Iyer do not understand how to cope with those threats, if ever they become real.
USA is the greatest technology powerhouse in the world, reservoir of largest pool of scientific, artistic, technical and intellectual resources in the world. No other nation comes anything near. This talented resource pool, barring few remaining old cold warriors, is mostly inclined to have good thoughts for Indian civil democracy.
Let the Icons of Indo-US relationship in four fields of human endevour be%u2013 Jayaprakash Narayan, Dr. Bhimrao Ramji Ambedkar, Swami Vivekananda and S Chandrasekhar. We shall than obtain true perspective to purposefully conclude this N-deal.
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Lucky B on Aug 29, 2007 04:43 AM Permalink
Do you know what happened in Arentina and what is happening there curtsy globalization.
RE:RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by mr on Aug 29, 2007 05:10 AM Permalink
Thats what I am asking you the same question, don't blame one side for anything, tell others people's fault also. You have license to say anything about democracies, means, you can tell anything. Tell other facts about other people too & ask me, i will answer
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Galaxy Star on Aug 29, 2007 12:45 AM Permalink
Mr.Ramesh Nittor needs to be enlightened about the frightful dangers of poerful radiation, from which the human race in India cannot survive! Remember the 1945 bombings of US. over Hiroshima and Nagasaki in Japan due to which thousands of peopele were killed miserably besides the slow deaths of other thousands of people of Japan due to ill effects of subsequent radiation! It is U.S who bombed then too. A active huge nuclear reactor is full of radio active radiation that is highly dangerous to human life! It may leak at any time due to unanticipated accidents in the reactor. It may leak due to certain highly intensive natural calamities like a) Earth quake of higher intensity , b) heavy floods, c) Winds of high speed like cyclone and hurricane etc., Nuke reactors oare the first targets in cases of wars etc., As Justice Krishna Iyer said we have failed to honestly explore the possibilities of hydro-electro power generation at several places, the sources for which are aplenty,the competent engineers will certainly agree, which will is comparatively of not of great risks, besides as he said wind power and also solar power for rural electrification and agriculture which is most hugry for power can be explored as there are plenty of sources. Only the word modern carries away from good lives to bad lives. Utility is only criteria and none else!
RE:RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by mr on Aug 29, 2007 12:51 AM Permalink
Paki has nuclear reactors throughout their Country almost all regions. We have mekdha & mumtha to prevent anything happening in hydro.
RE:RE:RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by mr on Aug 29, 2007 12:53 AM Permalink
how a country its size like pakistan manage that much reactors, why not India w/ its energy needs go for additional electricity to satisfy by all means either nuclear ( which is mass produced clean fuel).
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Ramesh Nittoor on Aug 29, 2007 01:49 AM Permalink
Green movement is doing yeoman service for Indian development. It is sad that their real contribution is not appreciated, instead seen as 'anti-developmental'. The legal-framework within which they operate is quite weak and hence they have to take recourse to agitational mode. Green movement is crucial for fairer justice dispensation to dispossesed, ensuring adequate investments get made on minimising risks to people and environment, putting constrains on improper technology choices, and spurring development of efficient and cleaner technologies.
RE:RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Ramesh Nittoor on Aug 29, 2007 01:25 AM Permalink
Galaxy Star, yes you do raise a valid point about radioactivity risks. Please read "The Truth About Chernobyl" by Grigori Medvedev, earlier Dy Chief Engineerof the N-plant to get deeper insight. You will appreciate much more need for international inspection and sophtistcated measurment and control instrumentation, besides sound management policies.
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Gautam nil on Aug 29, 2007 03:17 AM Permalink
Mr.Ramesh Nittor, I was in research on radio active physics after studying latest journals of the world! I have done appreciale works. Human faulures at certian places are unavoidable and are hence risky too! I dont want to enlighten you further as we have to write lot! Be practicable as such cases occurreed in several cases!
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by mr on Aug 29, 2007 03:39 AM Permalink
You study all the physics for you convenience, but you one sided blame US & west in your bloggs, first correct that.
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Ramesh Nittoor on Aug 29, 2007 03:46 AM Permalink
Yes, human failures are unavoidable, but we can take precautions and post-accident safety measures to reduce impact of damages. This needs international cooperation to get the learning curve benefits, and learn from other's mistakes. Plus there is also scope for making designs fail-safe. The Indian design of FBR, whiich is Thorium-PU-U233 based is supposed to be fail-safe design. This project will take many decades to implement, however with NSG cooperation, it probably would see the light of the day much earlier. The success of India's 3-stage nuclear programme probably depends on this success. India is a participant in ITER - Fusion Energy Advanced Tokomak (ITER- FEAT), makes good sense to invite international participation in FBR also. We need such scientific spirit to do genuinely good science.
RE:Real Icons, Real Values, Real Technology Policy
by Ramesh Nittoor on Aug 29, 2007 04:48 AM Permalink
Justice V R Krishna Iyer is a person of eminent repute. His seminal contribution to PIL has been an inspiration to our generation. PIL, indeed is a pathbreaking approach to law; has redfined the scope and extant of Indian law. It is this respect and how his views could make or break this N-deal, which propelled my response. His value premises can not be negated; they constitute the wider bulwark which defined freedom movement and drives today's politics. The perspectives within Indian management thought however necessarily differs!
If we don't prefer US which gave good earning from 1990, who else going to give good life for Indians other than US? There are people who can snatch away Indian part if given chance. You are telling that US hegemony etc.
RE:If we don't prefer US which gave good earning from 1990.
by Ashutosh Kole on Aug 28, 2007 11:20 PM Permalink
US is giving us a Good Life? What a pity that you think this. Do you know that the Indian economy is domestic need driven as opposed to china which is manufacturing driven (mainly from US and Europe) The BPO contribution, of which a big fuzz is made, is a meager percentage of the total economy. The majority of the big companies like Reliance, TATA, Birla, etc and the Agriculture and the Banking sector are not US dependent. Shame on you to be a US spokes person. You are the kind of people who will sell the country without a thought. And for your knowledge 0.1 percentage of Indians in US contribute to 17% of US economy. Get your facts right.
RE:If we don't prefer US which gave good earning from 1990.
by mr on Aug 28, 2007 11:26 PM Permalink
Our Country is service driven & our services has values to US. It is automatically inclined towards US, it is not my doubt. Manufacturing we are not doing that much great because of less infrastructre, we need to improve that to a great extent at least giving better products to our people itself.
RE:If we don't prefer US which gave good earning from 1990.
by Galaxy Star on Aug 29, 2007 12:00 AM Permalink
All should avoid this Mr.on, as by his overwhelming scribbles here he had adequately exposed his immature comments totally not based upon any any facts or senses just like kids! Let us not bother him by our cooments upon his immature scribbles! We will remain silent by just ignoing him!
RE:If we don't prefer US which gave good earning from 1990.
by mr on Aug 28, 2007 11:23 PM Permalink
I am not arguing who is giving what to what? We & others countries benefit economically & we are able to eat some food & away from poverty when we open our economy to US. Some people opened earlier than India, they also gained.
