Out of 23 supreme court judges minimum 20 judges should be from Dalits, OBC's and Muslims, according to the democratic principle of proportional representation.Now it is only solitary one.
by Dr Agnihotri on Apr 15, 2007 05:46 PM Permalink | Hide replies
Out of 23 supreme court judges minimum 20 judges should be from Dalits, OBC's and Muslims, according to the democratic principle of proportional representation.Now it is only solitary one.
Out of 23 supreme court judges minimum 20 judges should be from Dalits, OBC's and Muslims, according to the democratic principle of proportional representation.Now it is only solitary one.
Out of 23 supreme court judges minimum 20 judges should be from Dalits, OBC's and Muslims, according to the basic tenets of proportional representation.Now it is only solitary one. This is the main reason for the present MONSTROSITY in Higher Judiciary.Present stay of 27 OBC reservation is an example of it. The only long standing solution to this vexed question is the adoption of principle of proportional representation to all segments of Indian society, in the appointment of Supreme court Judges and High court judges .
Out of 23 supreme court judges minimum 20 judges should be from Dalits, OBC's and Muslims, according to the basic tenets of proportional representation.Now it is only solitary one. This is the main reason for the present MONSTROSITY in Higher Judiciary.Present stay of 27 OBC reservation is an example of it. The only long standing solution to this vexed question is the adoption of principle of proportional representation to all segments of Indian society, in the appointment of Supreme court Judges and High court judges .
Many OBCs feel that people who post against reservations are against the upliftment of OBCs. That is not true. I can take an oath on this. There are people like me who genuinely believe that reservation will hurt the OBCs. If I give money to a beggar, I will be doing him dis-service since he will remain a beggar. Will my son study if I tell him I will get him admission without studying. I want my son to learn. Not just get a degree. People talk about reservation. Howcome no one talks about pulling the OBCs up so that they can compete and even beat the so-called upper castes?
I am Neither Brahmin Nor OBC. I am a Maratha, Open category. Grandparents were petty farmers. I have written several posts on this issue. I do not wish to repeat. The key points that I made are that social justice should be done to everyone. All backward classes (social and economic) should be given free schooling and financial assitance for higher education.
But now I make a new point and that is the definition of OBC. Let us say that OBCs get admission in IITs and IIMs. However who exactly will enter these insitutions ? Let us find out.
The OBCs cover a wide range from caste standpoint and even wider range of economic standpoint. eg Both the Sonar (Gold Smith) and Lohar (Iron Smith) are considered OBCs. The Sonar are close to Brahmins in rituals and economic status. The Lohars are on the other end of the spectrum. The Sonars have economic clout and can even beat Brahmins in competitive exams. Guess who is getting in to IIT/IIM ? Sonar or Lohar even if the reservation is 90% ?
The Lohar is asking for reservation. Does he know who he will compete with ? Had the Sonar been removed from the OBC list, the Lohar had a good chance of getting in even if the reservation is 20% !
However if the reservation was based on economic criteria, the Lohar would have got admission due to his poor economic status. Plus no one would complain since kids in higher economic cetegory will pay donations to get admission! Once the Lohar's community improves, it will automatically get removed from the quota list making way for other deprived communities.
So dear OBC brothers and sisters, instead of just asking for a % in reservation, try to increase the chances of deserving OBC candidates.
There are 4 categories of OBCs: 1. OBCs genuinely needing support from society. We need to provide for their schooling, guidance and financial assitance for higher education. 2. OBCs who got admission on merit and are proud of it. They need to encourage others in doing the same. They should be future leaders! 3. OBCs who mis-used the quota system inspite of their good economic status and feel guilty. Dont repeat the mistake. Dont let your children mis-use it. Give other OBCs a chance. 4. OBCs who just want to get it free without any guilt. They cannot survive in a competitive environment. They will work in Government jobs with dusty files and waste their lives in government job culture. What do they know about MNCs, Programming, Project Management, International experience. They are like frogs in the Pond.
Only OBCs can solve their own problem. Others tring convincing them only causes more hatred.
Mr Arjun Singh is blatantly violating our fundamental 'Right to Equality' by actually discriminating among people as OBCs and non-OBCs. We didn't know if the person sitting next to us belonged to which caste, but he intends to make us more 'knowledgible' in this regard. And the nation just sits back and let him play his powerplay. Is there no law to punish a person who violates our fundamental right? Yes, we need to uplift the poor of India. And if you say 'Reservations' is the answer, FINE. But show me the results of the Reservations you have had for the last SIXTY years. What have you achieved through Reservations so far? And show us the projections and results you expect out of this Reservation now. And for how long do you want to have these reservations? What are the success parameters by which we will measure these reservations? When are they planned to be ended? Or will they go on forever? We want figures, Mr. Arjun Singh. We want to know the 'merit' in Reservations'. And I'm certain such a skewed thinking cannot have fathomed this. You can only fool the illiterates with your false and misleading promises. If you really had good intentions at your heart for the so called 'OBCs', you would have had much more promising reasons and answers than to rely upon data from ancient India(1939). The very fact that YOU find the necessity for reservations even now is the complete truth about how successful reservations of the last 60 years have been. And yet, you will bully through with your adamant ignorance, and we will pay dearly for the mistake we made of choosing leaders like you. We need an equal country. The meritorius will uplift all and the nation will move forward. Don't divide us and try to rule for the few years you have left of your life. You are jeopardising a billion people's all the future years with your lust for power at all costs.
Discussing quota is one thing...implementing is other..bill is already crossed the not very difficult gates of parliament..it's just a matter of time before pigeon is left alone among cats and they will be closing in sooner or later...The problem is still larger...than just quota..it's about practicing honestly what is enforced....had it been done, probably, materialization of reservatoin when it was implemented the first time, would have shown better resutls...meaning..reservation by itself isn't bad..but it's implementation definitely is...If bill is implemented what can you do about it?? If it is not implemented, are you satisfied with the policy existing reservation system(SC/ST etc)?? why political party back it? If any political party come to power, what's the guarantee that it won't vouch for a similar bill?? If democracy stands for power and voice of people, is the voice for reservation what people want? WOn't people have any say on a bill that impacting population and resources at large?? Democracy, the way it has been adopted in our country with so many political parties leads only to chaotic governance..one party's doing things only to be undone by the subsequent party at helm..be that good or bad...result...a step forward and a step back...effectively are we progressing forward at formidable rate...the destination being a matured and peaceful society irrespective of place, population ..through out the country...it shouldn't be felt that democracy is all that bad...it definitely must have done some good..else it would have been discarded by now....but at the same time we see the rise of maoism..definitely gives an indication that not everyone is happy..governance and burocracy has only resulted in the arresting the pace of forward movement....I am not a policy maker or anything of the sort..but to me it appears that we have completed only one half of the loop..i.e giving political leader the power of representation of people..but the other half is forgotten..how is the leader accountable to people?? Will people have to wait for 5 years till another election..with all planning and resources(namely people's money)invested in something that people don't want?? This implies for the current 5 years...the rule is no more democratic..but...autocratic...So, I feel there is an overall need for an overhaul of the system...with a view of more popular participation in governance..one may ask, wont it make it more chaotic..definitely, a point can be reached during formulation of rule, so that an optimal solution can be reached at to make thinz minimal choatic..moreover, if we are happy with the current setting...at least with people participation, we will have to blame ourselves for our deeds...and it not's very difficult to implement..a bill of such magnitude should definitely have required it..may be bills of the category of reservation requires review not just by president but also by states and districts and municipalities...panchayats..(if not all citizens of india)...could have been one of the steps towards it..but then you can always have questions/answers and counter-questions/answers over it..but ultimately, the theoretical limit of democracy(of the people, by the people and for the people) and that by current model should always be questionable and is an example of process of evolution...else, it's stangnant and bound to stink sooner or later!!
We can call India developed only when the following can be achieved: 1. Children in all parts of India should be provided compulsary education. 2. Cost of certain very basic commodities (classified as food, clothing,etc.) should be reduced and standardised so that any Indian, rich or poor, has the purchasing power to buy the basic necessities of daily life. 3. Every Indian has the responsibility to help uplift the backward - but one needs to understand that the best solution is to provide them the opportunity to study and compete. 4. Lift all kinds of reservations in vogue. Enacting reservation is itself a sort of discrimination. All the government needs to do is provide equal opportunities to all Indians.
RE:Reservation in itself is a form of discrimination
by Kumar Bhargava on Apr 11, 2007 12:50 AM Permalink
Mr. Anbu Selvan Please accept my endorsement from the bottom of my heart. Yes, India will develop and become a member of super league only when basic necessities of life are guaranteed for every citizen. The downtrdden and the needy should and must be helped, not based on Caste. If 75 % of a State (for Example TN) are econimically backward, go ahead and give them maximum upliftment. Otherwise, it is a shame that 75 % of a State wants to call and hide under the tag of backwardness for benefits. Prepare the needy (educationwise) and make them capable of taking the exams along with Brahmins. If theydon't have money, support them with food, shelter, clothing. But the standard should not be watered down (like 95% marks for FC and 55 % for BC). Nowhere in the world is done like what is done in India.
RE:Reservation in itself is a form of discrimination
by ramani-mumbai on Apr 23, 2008 04:31 PM Permalink
IN MP recently an engg seat went to a OBC with 1 mark. will he compete and will he complete engg. But one seat for FC has been blocked and one man is frustrated. This is what is happening because of irrational policies.
Long live politics of caste. And that will doom India.
Answer this and get admission in IIM Question 1) who should get admission?
Option A) OBC student belongs to rich family got 60% I.e. having all facility such as books, guide, tuition etc
Option B) Poor student, belongs to either open class or OBC, got 55% not having books, borrow notes from friend
Option C) The person who gives great donation, and take admission on NRI quota
Question 2) your family member is sick, where you go? Option A) Person, who got admission through quota, and just pass in MBBS in low grade Option B) Person, who got admission on his talent, and just pass in MBBS with high grade Option C) you will use your great grand ma advice and go to temple, majid, church etc
Question 3) you open a company, whom you hire? Option A) Person, who got MBA degree with in 10 years, cause he got admission with quota Option B) Person, who got admission on his talent, high grade, and very brilliant Option C) yours brother in law
question 4) Who will be billionaire? Option A) OBC student, who got admission in IIM Option B) yar, our politician will be karodepathi as they will get vote on this. Option C) this QUOTA is only AMIR (not amir khan, but rich OBC) not for aam (mango ) admi
Final question Who will be road patti A) Aam admi B) Aam admi C) Aam admi
RE:The heading is incorrect...
by ANAND B on Apr 10, 2007 08:08 PM Permalink
Correct.
Reservation is for the weak. Spineless. Dont try to tell me that OBCs are weak. If at all reservation is required - I think it must be based on economic status. For that the govt. must learn to get tax from every one in the country. Then when you base your reservation on economic status it makes sense. I have seen rich and filthy rich SC, ST, OBC and Brahmins. I have also seen utterly poor SC, ST, OBC and Brahmins.
Dont jump around with wrong stats. All this arjun singh data are from 1930's.
RE:The heading is incorrect...
by Kumar Bhargava on Apr 10, 2007 11:52 PM Permalink
You often hear Central Ministers for quota, saying 'No one above law .. and Law will take its Course etc.). The Central Govt, especially whenever Congress rules, Supreme Court rulings are to be applied for Hindus and mainly upper castes. If this ruling were given against Brahmins and other upper castes, then all the ministers would have sung in chorus to apply them. The likes of Arundhati Roy, Brinda Karat and Shabana Azmis will be nowhere in the news. But in situations like this one, the Law will be bypassed by a consitiutional amendment. Recall what Rajiv did in Shah Bano case. This is what Arjun Singh means when he says 'All options will be explored'.
