Muslims should be considered as a religioius minority community in India,their religion being not the religion of India and not because of their percentage of population in India. (We all know it , to be increasing at a very rapid rate )This holds true for all other minority religions in India.Is there any special status for Hinduism outside India?
RE:Muslims as a religious minority community in India
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:37 PM Permalink
How does the idea of giving minority status to 150 million muslims, the second largest muslim population in any nation and larger than the population of many nation put together sound to you.
RE:Muslims as a religious minority community in India
by Abhijeet on Apr 06, 2007 02:14 PM Permalink
Religion of any country should not be based on it's size of population in that country nor based on what is happening outside that country.It should be based on it's place of origin and this is depending on that territory of that country.History has a very strong evidence in proving how certain religions have penetrated to country like India.Muslim community have used sword to propagate their religion in India.This is how it had come to India.There are certain other religions also, as per the tradition of India goes on to say,had questioned the faith of many Hindu people about their religion and in their very own land.Is this what their religion stands for?Forcible conversion is what is religion for certain communities.How could they be accepted as equal to Hinduism?Many outside countries may have accepted them ,but this should be not the reason why should be accepted here in India.
RE:Muslims as a religious minority community in India
by Abhijeet on Apr 06, 2007 05:14 PM Permalink
Try to know the views and sentiments of majority Hindu population spread all over India.
The BJP has been stripped open and the partys true face, their motives, their hatred for Muslims, and their hypocrisy have all been made very apparent by their release of this communal CD. -- not that it wasnt clear enuf earlier!
The CD is definately meant to flame communal passions and to "appease" the majority hardliner Hindus. It openly advocates and rather preaches hatred against Muslims and portrayes them ALL as terrorists. To call it "highly provocative and inflammatory" is an understatement.
What this CD has also brought to light is the cowardice (or impotence if u will) of the party to even stand upto their preached hatred and to own upto their "mistake" even after the partys top leadership having acknowledged the contents of the CD themselves.
The Godhra incident covered on the CD puts ALL the MUSLIMS on the pedestal for the death on karsevaks and then turns a blind eye to the even more henious crimes of the State sponsored RIOTS which killed far far more MUSLIMS and left countless others homeless/jobless/family-less.
The Riots following the Godhra incident were much more atrocious and monstrous than the burning of the train not just because of the far greater number of victims but because THAT was an act of terrorism by STATE as opposed to an attack by a terrorist organization.
And THIS too when there is till date NO PROOF watsoever of a MUSLIM being responsible for setting the train on fire. For all that we know, the train was set ablaze by Narendra Modi govt hired goons (who could be Hindu or Muslim for name sake) to vent their hatred of Muslims by placing the blame on them and in the process also solidfying their Hindu vote bank.
The sole purpose of a terror outfit is to create terror. Was that the job of Narendra Modi govt too? -- Even assuming that the hired goons were indeed Muslims (tho such scumbags have no religion) from some terror organization.
And till date, what justice have those riot victims got -- Is Narendra Modi behind bars? All of his ministers run around scot-free --thats the justice that has been delivered. So if some day one of these riot victims, who lost his sister, mother and father in the brutal most manners possible was to take it upon himself to avenge their deaths, wouldnt he be labelled a terrorist? AND what if that perosn who saw his sister being raped, his father being burned alive and his mother being clubbed to death was YOU!!! Ever thought about that? Wouldn%u2019t u want to avenge their deaths in the barbaric most way possible?
The bottom line is, BJP and esp its sister parties like VHP, Bajrang Dal, Shiv Sena are fundamentally agaisnt the constitution of India; namely Secularism. They despise, loathe, abhor and detest the (Indian) Muslim and anything even remotely related to Muslims -- Be that be even a Muslim name bearing PRESIDENT OF INDIA.
They dont want any progress of Muslims and hate it when other parties even talk of taking up the Muslim cause. Apart from advocating hatred all they have done is add two new words to their vocabulary - Minority appeasement.
Well, someone needs to tell em that -- Minority appeasement -- and -- Minority bashing -- are two sides of the same coin. The truth is: Both these attempts try to perpetuate group identity so that the respective parties can keep alive their own communal vote bank. So when one votes, he does not cast his vote to the better party but to the LESSER EVIL of the two.
RE:BJPs true UGLY face
by Kumar Rahul on Apr 06, 2007 04:01 PM Permalink
Mr. Tabish, if you go on posting such messages several times in a thread, you will be branded fanatic, and people will run away without reading it. It wil not serve the very purpose you are posting for.
The CD episode is irrelevent with reference to this page. I think congress is the mother of all religious divives. BJP is just retaliating.
May our judiciary become so powerful and fearless that they abolish all kinds of reservations -- based on religion or caste. Only true merit should be given importance, nothing else, then only our nation will become No. 1 in the world and free from malice.
Reservation in elections should be done away with right away. All reserved constituencies should be dereserved. No person with dubious character should be given tickets.
RE:minority quota
by Anand on Apr 06, 2007 01:34 PM Permalink
Yes you are. Though the reservation based on religion and cast must be done away with......what about those who do not have the resources for the education. Only merit can not be the solution as those with diminished financial resources would not get any help. There must be help for those who are financially incapable of geting education.
RE:minority quota
by paramjit kaur on Apr 06, 2007 01:39 PM Permalink
I am all in favour of merit. All the meritorious women can come up in life without reservation and you can see around you in offices and school. Do you think they are there because of any reservations for them?
As for providing education to the poor where is the need for reservation if you give them scholarships or free education??
RE:minority quota
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:50 PM Permalink
Well, women need reservation more than anybody. Giving reservation to them atleast removes the division along caste lines and religion. Maybe the reservation that BJP's manifesto includes for UP elections where it offers 20 % reservation for women in govt. jobs and local bodies might make a dent on the strong holds of SP and BSP. I personally support giving reservation to muslim women and empowering them will break the back bone of mullah strong hold on Indian Muslims. You just cannot say all women came up on their own in a male dominated society. They were given avenues to enter and make their mark and merit too played it's role. But that is a good thing too.
RE:[object MouseEvent]
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:53 PM Permalink
It's not as simple as you think. Giving free education and scholarship cannot all the way remove the centuries old hierarchial structure. It takes reservation to bring a caste to adjust to changing times that has made it's life for thousands of years by making leather or beating drums in villages.
Please explain how reservation 'bring a caste to adjust to changing times' and why do you think making leather or beating drums is bad. If you are good at doing something why not?. The only change needed, I think, is the way we look at lower caste people and give them respect for their work and as humans.
RE:minority quota
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 04:27 PM Permalink
i never said doing those skill work is bad. Just that they have to change according to times when traditional work is replaced in many fields by machinery and technology. So what will the guy really earn if the person practices same profession as his/her ancestors and gets paid in meagre amounts relative to the people sitting in board rooms whose salary increases manifold each year. You should see it in a historical prespective where things change. Bill gates earns more than merchants of ancient times and he does different work. So the others change with him and he represents that change. All professions should be respected, but that is the noble idea that is prescribed in Hindus shastras too which was later misused by vested interests who made sure people stay in their castes and disriminated them. People need avenues to enter into those domains which made the transition like the middle class upper castes have done. They need means to do it and for that reservation is essential to "lift" them from their traditional fields of work and update them. Maybe there are other means to do it without giving reservation, but given that in India people discriminate a lot on caste basis, there needs to be state affirmative actions like reservation.
RE:minority quota
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:33 PM Permalink
what about reservation for women in educational institutions, municipal, state and central legislative bodies and government jobs. Do you want it abolished too?
i wonder how this jusdge came to such a decision, as Muslims according to census 2001 are around 15-20% pop'n of u.p., while Hindus approx 80%. so why are they not minority? he needs to explain his judgement.
are yaar yeh toh sabki dukaan band kar denge.minority ke naam pe kitano ki kamai band aur 'mulla'yam ki rajniti ka kya hoga.waise medak ko kuwa hi duniya lagati hai so muslim community sub jaan ke bhi anjaan hi rahegi.
RE:sub car se sahi mein cycle pe aa jayenge
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:24 PM Permalink
if UP does not recognise minority status of muslims, then WB, Kerala, Assam will follow where percentage of muslims in these states is more than that in UP.
RE:RE:RE:[object MouseEvent]
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:27 PM Permalink
Muslims would like to call themselves as minority until they can bring shariah rule through out India. That is the name of the game called minority.
RE:Have empathy for your own Kinsmen.
by chaitanya kumar on Apr 06, 2007 01:05 PM Permalink
you are right. they look like orangutan or something like that. It should be named a separate specie.
RE:Have empathy for your own Kinsmen.
by U Prabhu on Apr 06, 2007 01:15 PM Permalink
You have not a inch of indea about indian history. And unless you read it full Maha don't even make such loose statements. Ex-Hindus now Muslims were converted forcibly by the Muslim rulers mostly. And others under the influence that Hinduism was a lesser religion, something which Islam has always did the world over. If someone has to be made responsible for their poor conditions then it has to be then themselves.
Dear sir, Pl go through the last sensus report, the population has been increased 3 fold. This itself is enough to say not only in UP but also allover india there are truely not at all minority either religiously, or in any way. They are enjoying all facilities of government projects,take even HAJ YATRA. NO hindu is provided with any such facility to go to yatra even out side india we have hindu, temple, at combodia ANGKORWAT TEMPLE,MANAS SAROVAR this is an example. our politicians should stop propagating muslims as minority religion or group, for the sake of vote bank.Till our politicians not realise this matter god only should save our country.
RE:muslims are not a religious minority in up
by Wazid P on Apr 06, 2007 01:05 PM Permalink
Dear Sir, The whole story about Haj subsidy is blown out of proportion, by a few political parties. Are you aware that the price of subsidized tickets for Haj, in Indian Airlines, is only 10% less than the actual price? In addition, the airlines do very good business during that time, by increasing the no. of flights and making people to take only IA flights because of this so-called subsidy. They make huge profit by the volumes, though the profit margin is less.
RE:muslims are not a religious minority in up
by DrYNI Anand on Apr 06, 2007 01:36 PM Permalink
Mr Wazid is very much right. This is all a propaganda by the politicians to catch a "few" votes of the so called minorities by appeasing them with peanuts. As far as the general public is concerned, the government spends hundreds of crores of rupees every year on this so called "Haj Subsidy". They make an equal amount (or more) since they organise several extra flights as per Mr Wazid. It is a different matter that even these peanuts are not available to Hindus wanting to visit Kailash Manasarovar. Instead, the government charges exorbitant amount as taxes and other levies on the hapless pilgrims. It is also a different matter that no other country (including Muslim countries) in the world offers subsidies to the pilgrims. A Couple of things appear strange to me. Firstly, why the Indian Muslims, despite knowing that they are offered peanuts, still accept the offer? Secondly, why other airlines do not organise the trip at much lower cost that they can afford and make more volume of money rather than percentage? Allah hee is sawal ko jawab de sakta hai.
This court verdict does not affect a common muslim person in any way. The classification of muslims as "minority" is in no way an advantage for muslims. If at all there is an advantage to somebody, by this classification, it's only for the management of a few educational institutions which call themselves as minority institutions. In fact, muslims are supposed to pay full fees in these so-called minority institutions and the grants are eaten by the management. So, I don't see any need for discussing this topic in such a passionate way, both by muslims and Hindus. In fact, removing this classification would be better for muslims, so that these political parties do not use that term any longer, to garner the votes of muslims.
RE:Court Verdict
by rachita bholowalia on Apr 06, 2007 01:30 PM Permalink
everyone is equal as followers of islam preach and why minority tag---this tag has not given any benefit to muslims till date and rather have been seen as a grave problem for country and who enjoyed this tag factully--islamic institutions congress sp bsp communists dmk rjd and many other regional sharks--they never really worked for betterment of any indian irrespective of religion--yes they damaged muslims and hurt their feelings but alwyas posed as messiah of minority--dear muslim friends i request u to join mainstream of society and go for controoled population, educate yr children and donot play in hands of these secular parties--a fact is that hindus cannot overlook muslims as in max cities they r dependent on muslims--milk supply tailor barber craftsmen leather finishing and so on--even many articles reqd during hindu festivals r supplied by muslims---lalitkumar a rss follower
