I think now the situation has come when we should have two classes and abolish all other classes and castes, ie the Poor and The Rich. Reservation should be for the poor and no reservation for the rich. All facilities including freeships in studies/boarding/lodging etc everything should be only for the poor of whatever caste/religion it may be, whereas no reservation etc for any one whose falls in the rich category. This category of Rich and Poor may be defined judiciously. To understand my message one has to think if a poor man is not able to reach the qualifying level how he can avail the reservation fruits of the elite institutions. Well if at all reservations are to be gien they should be given at the school level and then may be reservation in the elite may not be required at all or it may be required to a small percentage. I think no one is wary of the the people belonging to the existing reserved category but it is the only Politicians who are out to ruin the country and it is high time they stop it or else if the public which had thrown the British out of India in no time, would not spare the Politicians. One can not stop the public be-ware POLITICIANS. The times are going to be very tough for everyone. In the end I would sum up by saying that all anti reservationist should atleast vote judiciously so that once the higher polling is observed, it would give a message to the Politicians of public awareness. Presently they are talking the educated class for granted.
RE:Reservation
by Gaurav Gaddhyan on Apr 02, 2007 02:19 PM Permalink
totally agree, just one point... rather than reservation, they should be provided with adequate resources to be able to compete with rich kids
RE:Reservation
by Roy on Apr 02, 2007 02:21 PM Permalink
Mr.Deepak, You are cautioning against politicians, but which politicians ? Congress, BJP, BSP, SP, CPM, and all other NDA or UPA partners are all in the same league. So whom to avoid and whom to adhere ? There is no better choice for the people in India.
1. It explicitly creates irrational hierarchy among Indians which is against Article 14. 2. Parents covertly train their children to coerce other children as per the above hierarchies. I deplore any other religion that does this.
RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by deepak kapoor on Apr 02, 2007 02:30 PM Permalink
Dear, I dont know how old are you or waht is your mental age. Infact Old saying Loo before you leap and Speak before you think. Hinduism is the only way of life which guarantees job to everyone. Till 30 years ago the things were doing well and the basic food/water/shelter etc was not a problem in our country which had god fearing people; but after the mordernisation in India the Farmers are selling their lands and settling for other jobs not fit for them and ruining themselves, Tailors leaving their jobs and now working for Branded readymaded names and in turn working more to earn the same ammount as they use to earn earlier, making their own life miserable, The sweepers who were employed by the Municiple Corporations are now not doing it as they all have joined IAS/IPS/IFS and other Govt Jobs (god knows what they are doing their, where so many of the top learned have not been able to do anything except minting money)and all the urban streets are places to watch because now no one can call spade a spade. Likewise their are so many chaotic situations which are hampering our basic system and all these all intact in places say 50 years ago. All systems have flaws, the Manuwadi sytem too had certain loopholes and they were being exploited by a section of the society. This should have been repaired instead of calling the Hiduism as whole the root cause of all evils in India. I hope I recieve your sorry message within 24 hours or else I suggest you to convert to Islam/Christianity or any religion which has all goods and nothing bad. DO REPLY.
RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by Biswajit Ghoshal on Apr 02, 2007 03:55 PM Permalink
m, Brahmins and high castes were too abused and manipulated alongwith others. Just read histories - how brutally the high caste people were abused during Mughal-period, Jain and Buddha periods.
RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by Biswajit Ghoshal on Apr 02, 2007 04:02 PM Permalink
m - without knowing anything about it don't talk about Hinduism.
Why does then your Islam (and Koran) say that all other religions are bad and that Mohammed is the last Nabi - although we had Ramakrishna and Aurobindo - who were philosophically and religiously much open and of very high scale than Mohammed? Isn't by saying that Islam is letting all other religions down? Why did Islamic preacher destroyed all the Hindu temples in North India, WTC etc? Can we then say, Islam is the root cause of global terrorism??
RE:Hinduism is the root of all evil in India.
by m on Apr 02, 2007 02:18 PM Permalink
Sorry Girish. Have you noticed how many times you used "abusive language" in this MB.
RE:[object]
by Biswajit Ghoshal on Apr 02, 2007 04:06 PM Permalink
Sorry m, Have you noticed how you are trying to divert the attention from politics and social justice to religion? Only in Hindu dominant country like India, you can say badly about Hinduism - and still remain free? If you say badly about Islam in B'desh or Pakistan or Saudi Arabia - you are dead. Why are Islamists so intolerant about other religions??
Most of the so called SC/ST/OBCs are indeed extremely well off (compared to the 'forward' class). If a nation-wide census is taken and analysed, it will prove that more percentage of them and better than those of "forward" classes.
So whatever data does the govt bring out it would only prove the above point - which is why Arjun and Co. are taking time to manipulate the data and then interpreat that. In fact the 22.5 percent quota too should be withdrawn now, that having been effective for too long than originally stated.
RE:
by m on Apr 02, 2007 02:08 PM Permalink
Reservations are legislative (not judicial or society) response to historical social injustices to certain sections of the society.
RE:RE:
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 02:10 PM Permalink
surprise surprise Yadavs who commit most violence against Dalits are now claiming reservation benefit
RE:Well off SC/ST/OBCs - remove 22.5 quota too
by Biswajit Ghoshal on Apr 02, 2007 04:10 PM Permalink
First understand that to address those injustices we do not need to bring down the standard of education/work in our instututes of excellence. To address those causes, govt can strengthen the numerous programs for poverty eradication. Quota will be exploited by creamy layer section of OBCs - the illeterate/backward people will remain so.
If the Yadavs, extremely powerful and owning money in terms of crores, are "backward", then may I ask who is "forward"?
All the political parties are just thinking in terms of vote-bank and no logic. The main reason for the govt to say that they will go to SC after SAARC, is that THEY (ARJUN SINGH, KARUNANIDHI, YECHURI AND CO.) DO NOT HAVE ANY STRONG LOGICAL DATA-DRIVEN CASE, which can stand the scrutiny in a court of law. And to cover up that they are just taking time. Shame on these politicians.
RE:Govt's case for quota
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 01:55 PM Permalink
not only are many OBCs rich but they are the ones who commit violence about Dalits.
The main reason that backward category is demanding reservations is that they were suppressed and treated badly some years back...ok
during mughal empire even hindu brahmins were forced to convert to muslims..and there were attrocities against them and were suppressed..
so if OBC's and SC/ST's are given reservation due to their past then even brahmins should be given reservation on the basis of the past attrocities done by muslims against them...
but instead the government wants to give reservation to muslims...lol.. dont u see its just vote bank politics???
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 01:49 PM Permalink
7000 years ha ha ha even human civilization didnt exist for so long wat a joke
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 01:45 PM Permalink
you are desperate to convert India to a banana republic he he he
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Gaurav Gaddhyan on Apr 02, 2007 01:51 PM Permalink
My friend, who is cheating you... all it is said that meritocracy should be criteria.... anyways only fools can be manipulated for 7000 years... seems u put yourself in fool's category.
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Gaurav Gaddhyan on Apr 02, 2007 02:15 PM Permalink
dear friend m... Indian Government in not meritocratic... agreed, but first of all we are not talking about government, we are talking about educational institute, and second world is meritocratic, people get selected because of ability they possess rather than the caste to which they belong. Democracy is one of best form of running government, but one of principles of democracy is equality of opportunity, equal opportunity to all people irrespective of their caste, sex or color. Now what reservation does is exactly opposite, giving preference to some while not to others. Democracy for heaven's sake doesn't mean that equal representation of each class of soceity. What democracy means is equal opportunity for everyone in soceity. True SCs, STs and some sections of OBCs didn't have fair share of opportunity due to lack of resources, but government here instead of giving reservation should give free education of poor society so reason of not succeeding is not lack of resources. And in current Indian scenario, caste is no longer a appropriate criteria for differentiating lack of resources, some of richest persons u will find belong to backward castes and vice versa. Rather income should be the criteria. If any reservation should be there it should be on the basis of income. And instead of giving reservation, it would be better if work is done at more basic level, because from my experience these reserved candidates find it extremely difficult to pass in most easiest of cources, most of them ultimately unable to complete their degree, some who are able to do so land up in pathetic jobs. So ultimately u r playing with these kids future also, whom u r sending to compete with the best in country without giving appropriate training.
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 01:54 PM Permalink
looks like this guy is the self-appointed spokesperson for OBCs. Another reason could be he was beaten to 1st rank by an UC
RE:RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 02:00 PM Permalink
wat is the solution for Indias problems then ? I am focussing on WHAT
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Girish Rao on Apr 02, 2007 02:14 PM Permalink
you look like a lunatic you seem to no points to debate. All you blabber is just 7000 years which is not true at all. No sense in wasting my time talking to a certified lunatic. You can continue with the sham of 7000 years
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by m on Apr 02, 2007 02:22 PM Permalink
Girish that's why I am saying
Hinduism is the root of all evil in India. 1. It explicitly creates irrational hierarchy among Indians which is against Article 14. 2. Parents covertly train their children to coerce other children as per the above hierarchies. I deplore any other religion that does this.
RE:reservation and its negative impacts
by Biswajit Ghoshal on Apr 02, 2007 04:14 PM Permalink
m - that's what I am also saying - Islam is the root cause of all the terrorisms. 1. The Islamic rulers of all the Islamic countries give privilege to Muslims. 2. It preaches against all other religions by saying it is the best religion and Muhammed is the last Nabi - although its philosophical base is very poor. 3. It utterly suppresses women - by allowing 4 wives for 1 man.
the deciscion of supreme court is remarkable one since it stayed the government order on OBC quota.Insted of making protests and demonstrations every anti-reservation activist should prove their ability & talent insted of depending on these reservations.
we are talking too much about up-liftment of the backward.Time is ripe enuogh to define the term backward because it is being used as a tool to devide everybody on the lines of caste.it is to be decided wheteher the person belonging to a perticular caste is backward or a person not having the access to the resources of human need backward.
