Many a times I have seen our people misbehave. Recently I was at the check in counter of an air line and a person was screaming at the staff for not taking him. Te counter closed atleast 10 minutes earlier. Also the customers should be treating the staff politely. How many times do we hear some one saying 'Thank You' or a 'please'? So it is natural for these guys to ignore you. It is also a lack of proper training for these people who is supposed to handle customers with a smile.
RE:Ill trated?
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 05:10 PM Permalink
I am an air hostess and I really feel like pouring hot soup on the INDIAN men who try to gape me in flights as if they have never seen a women before. Foreign men dont behave like this ever.
RE:Ill trated?
by sandip dey on Jan 02, 2008 05:44 PM Permalink
Shamita, your point is kind of true. But a generalization in this regard is not worth. You dont have to be an indian to gape. Its more of a personality problem than anything else.
RE:Ill trated?
by ashish on Jan 02, 2008 06:01 PM Permalink
iv been a flt attendant too and i agree with shamita ,indians are the worse behaved passengers as for the labour class well i agree crfew do treat them bad but in the end its the indian culture ,u have rude indian rich pasengers and prude crew who given a chance wil vent frustrns on the labour class
indian 5 star hotels are the prime boot lickers of the goras--this is evident right from the hospitality desk to the captains--their deference sucks.it is not necessary that all goras are polite--similarly not all indians are rude but indians abroad dare not act as they do in india. but the most glaring part in hotels is the dress code where foreigners get away with murder whereas a desi will get glares even for a pair of chappals. Nothing can change this mind set or hypocrisy.
RE:funny
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:55 PM Permalink
YOU ARE WRONG
At an Indian restaurant in Bangkok I saw an Indian family of just 4 - husband, wife and 2 kids - creating such a ruckus with the kids running all over the place and the parents screaming after them as if they were sitting at home, I had to get up and flee out of sheer shame. In Indra Market you can see them bargaining heatedly and going to the extent of arguing with the hawkers for not reducing prices further. Would you believe this: I once saw an Indian chewing gutka at the departure lounge of the old airport and spitting on the carpet.
I think travel agencies that organise those thousands of package tours ought to spare a thought for the motherland's honour and educate their clients on how to behave in a foreign land. Any flight full of Indians is a cringing shame when you see the men grab at the drinks and harassing air hostesses for endless refills.
RE:funny
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 05:03 PM Permalink
I have been to the US too. Here what i saw in typical Indian tourist there -
1. Talking loudly on the fone, no matter how clear the line is. 2. (my ex-roomies have done this ... ) not lifting the seat while takin' a pee !!! 3. Staring endlessly (at others, once eye contact is made)! 4. Unshaved stubbles (..or the pride of keeping one !) 5. Agree with roy, WALKIN INTO A HOUSE WITH SHOES ON (over time ive realised this is partly because of smelly socks !) 6. An entire family looking over one guy, when he is taking the BTS card from the vending machines ! 7. Attempts to reduce the guy to less than a shilling, while trying to bargain. 8. Using a cellphone inside a plane. 9. Saying 'No' by shaking ur hand and head at the same time. 10. Middle aged uncles doing a shammi kapoor twist in a hip hop club !
RE:funny
by Arun V on Jan 02, 2008 08:43 PM Permalink
What is your problem of their personality? You may be refined, but that doesnt anyway qualify you to provide judgement on other human being, let it india, american, british. Just who are you? What is your local stande?
In a tourist etiquette survey (carried out by Expedia, a travel website) the Indians were second worst, followed by the Chinese and then the Russians. The survey was conducted in Europe amongst 15,000 European hoteliers who were asked to rate tourists on ten attributes: Politeness, willingness to try out local cuisine, the state in which tourists left their rooms, the tips they gave, the way they dressed, how noisy they were, how considerate they were%u2026
So why did Indians score so badly? Don%u2019t we know it? We are the rudest people on earth! On this attribute we scored worse than anybody else. Well, rudeness is a national past-time in India%u2026who hasn%u2019t been at the receiving end of the indifference of a sales girl/boy, the brusque tone of a government official, the sneer of the security guard, the insulting tone of a school principal, or who hasn%u2019t experienced the shove from the suited booted guy standing behind in the queue or borne the rude honking of the car behind? Rudeness unfortunately is an everyday phenomena in India. You get so used to it that when someone is polite, its a mild shock..
RE:RE:Indians were voted as 2nd most rudest tourists in the world
by Amal Roy on Jan 02, 2008 05:35 PM Permalink
Hello Shamita, I certainly do agree with you, there was a time when we used to board the British airways flight from Kuwait, even before the seat belt fasten sign was off, Sister was the word went around to ask for drinks, and the overdose and womitting around made a mess. The BA crew then became rude, I certainly do not blame them. But I had seen the sometime the ground staff,security at Frankfurt sometimes pretty rude for no reasons and I was a victim too. I have travelled around the world, its always not the same everywhere, even the whites are also sometimes very rude, but I don't understand why we run after these Whites, yes what I would always say, your Upbringing matters and it says it all, whether in India or abroad.
I have been a waiter myself& let me tell you these goras treat you well and they are respectful....but a desi treats you like u are his ghar ka naukar....with total disdain...no thank you or for that matter a smile....man tips is not all that counts...it's dignity of labour that we desis need to learn about...you will never find a gora cliking his fingers to call a waiter....so we desis need to learn manners before expecting a similar kind treatment
RE:.....bcause they dont treat u like a servant.....
by on Jan 02, 2008 04:34 PM Permalink
Ravi Krishnan, I think you are an India-baiter, and not a former waiter. Hey guy do not suffer from a massive inferiority complex because you are an Indian. Widen your horizon and you will find that people are people, and you get all types everywhere, including in Timbaktu. Goras too click their fingers. Haven't you seen English flicks on the tube?
RE:.....bcause they dont treat u like a servant.....
by ralph nader on Jan 02, 2008 04:55 PM Permalink
where is the necessity of clicking fingers when waiters are next to them fawning all over
RE:.....bcause they dont treat u like a servant.....
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:21 PM Permalink
the problem with indians is ki chaar paisey aaye nahi, apney app ko duniya ka raaja samajney lagtey hein aur auro ko gulaam.
When this changes, Waiters will run to serve Indian tourists.
RE:.....bcause they dont treat u like a servant.....
by ravi kumar on Jan 02, 2008 05:34 PM Permalink
I support ravi krishnan indians need to learn dignity of labour. But in this age it can only come through proper advertisement of this quality. But another aspect is tips and because desis are drawn towards white skin. Because not all desis are bad mannered. and not all whites are good mannered. Its ultimately economics that is driving such behavior. Needless to say if a restaurent is owned by a proper businessman be it a white or desi he will care about one who spends more isn't it. So what these people end up doing is racial profiling. Sad thing but true. Similarly when a terrorist blows himself all the muslim junta come under scanner. Because they are one of them. Though some of them might be better than ourself. So There are some things which cannot be solved though many people are aware of whats right and whats wrong. Its a mob behavior and the only way one can treat a particular of mob is by stereotyping. So guys just chill.
RE:.....bcause they dont treat u like a servant.....
by indu jha on Jan 02, 2008 05:03 PM Permalink
gentleman can u give me some update on how much revenue hotels are generating from foreigners.Remember this stats should not be based on one region only. If u will take the statistics of the whole country ,u can easily find out that more than 80% revenu hotel industry is getting from desis not from forigners.So u hv to be nice with everyone no matter from where the person belong to.U hv to be professional instead of teaching professionalism to customer.
RE:.....bcause they dont treat u like a servant.....
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 05:08 PM Permalink
IT IS ABOUT DIGNITY, KEEP YOUR MONEY TO YOURSELF. NO ONE CARE A DAMN FOR RUDENESS AND ILL MANNERS THAT TYPICAL Indian tourist display towards waiters and housekeepers as if they OWN their lives. Foreigners NEVER behave like this.
Panchkula ,afternoon,4pm.,Wednesday, 2nd Jan. 2008 Well Mr Sunny vandikut and et al have been deliberately seen to be humiliated by our service people in spots of modern hospitality resorts such as in Goa , Marine-Drive ,Mumbai or Triplicane Beach in Chennai,because Swiss, Russian or WELSH AND OTHER EUROPEANS ARE around. This is because the ill-paid service personnel expects bigger tips and some kind racketeering in Narcotics , skin-trade or plain old Habits of Colonial servility still linger on at these watering resorts around our Port Towns and tourist stations.. This feeling of being jilted by indian waiters is perhaps a fitting response to our chic inferiority ridden media personnel, who rarely have any self -respect,themselves, in aping the mannerisms of the most mediocre foreign visitors at the cost of their own people and their works...D.Goel
RE:Well the heritage of servility Persists
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:07 PM Permalink
AND WHY NOT. Do you know how indian tourists talk to waiters and lower level staff as if they own their lives ? Problem is within Indians who behave like lords and expect all to bow to them.
RE:Well the heritage of servility Persists
by Aarti on Jan 02, 2008 04:37 PM Permalink
No Shamita, I beg to differ. We Indians are given second rate services even in premium establishments. Irrespective whether you speak in fluent English or treat the waiters & lower level staff with respect.
It is sad to know that WHITE SKIN (goras) is given preference in our own country.
I have seen this happening in one of the five star hotels in Southern India.
waha ke bhikariyon ko yaha raja jaisey treat kartey hain hain aur unkey desh main they dont even sit beside you ... we are still think that we are slave of them..... Indians you really want to know what forigners esp europeans/russians think about you go to their countries..
Indians ... grow up get matured and get some self respect. And about goans they are protuges not Indians.
RE:Firung bhikari
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:05 PM Permalink
this is the exact difference between Indians and foreigners . so if a poor foreigner is coming to india you call him a bhikhari. he may not be an enginner or IT guy, but still he is a person. There is dignity of labour there.
So I can safely assume that you dont treat your lower class Indians like your driver and maid servant well too like 90% of Indians.
Why do we think money and being rich is the only way to gain respect in society.
In my book a waiter, or a butler, or a driver as long as he is doing his duty honestly is also RESPECTABLE.
This snobbish attitude of Indians is really really bad and creates tensions in society.
RE:Firung bhikari
by saraswathi ramachandran rama on Jan 02, 2008 10:42 PM Permalink
hi very true about the hypocritical indian culture...there is caste and gender issue and sp many divisions and the worst thing is the "pious" image!and ultrasensitivity for even constructive criticism!
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Robin Joseph on Jan 02, 2008 03:56 PM Permalink
never tried that one... Thank you o great knowledge giver ! I also know that the gita says that no one's caste is determined by birth,It is based on the Gunas inherent in peoples%u2019 nature
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 03:59 PM Permalink
See lower caste people were those who did field work working out in the open sun, and hence they got dark skin.
People who did other work like studying vedas and other brainy work were not exposed to fierce sun, hence they got fair.
So in that era, if you would find a fairer person, you would naturally perceive him to be a brahmin and not a field labourer.
This is how fair skin = higher status came into being in India society. No relation to british or mughals, since they are a mere patch on indian history that stretches over 10,000 years, while these came only much much later.
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by on Jan 02, 2008 04:51 PM Permalink
Exposure to sun gives your skin a tan, not a color! Do you know all the human race descends from a single black South African mother. During the course of time genetic mutations and cross hybridisation resulted in changes in facial features, color of skin etc. Environment had no role in it. That hypothesis was thrown out by scientists decades ago. Chanakaya, prime minister to Ashoka of Magadh was a dark-skinned brahmin, while his other minister Rakshash was fair-skinned. The colour of skin is in the genes and not related to environment or profession. My cleaning lady is fairly dark but her son is as fair as any gora.
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:01 PM Permalink
I also think when common Indians must have seen white europeans for the very first time in the middle ages, they would have though they were from some devo lok or paradise ..... in awe totally and staring and curious as who they were.
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Robin Joseph on Jan 02, 2008 04:10 PM Permalink
Thats a good point... about the devo lok and jazz... but ahh! you look at India through rather small eyes... consider the northern and north-eastern states... Fair skin always irrespective of working in the sun or not
Consider Coorgies from karnataka... greek descent... fair skin again !
Plus, and i quote "people who did other work like studying vedas and other brainy work were not exposed to fierce sun, hence they got fair" they got fair !!! GOT fair! are you deliberately typing these or are you tryin to figure out how many people notice !
RE:RE:RE:RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Gokul Swamy on Jan 02, 2008 04:15 PM Permalink
I disagree. Most people in panjab were farmers/ field laborers and yet they are quite fair. Skin color has more to do with genetic make up and ancestry and not so much on the sun.
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:19 PM Permalink
Answer simple question why all super cold countries have people of VERY FAIR SKIN white and pink and why do all hot countries have dark skin ?
RE:RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Gokul Swamy on Jan 02, 2008 04:38 PM Permalink
Thats a result of natural selection and adaptation over millions of years. To suggest that placing an African male in Shimla will make him fair is ludicrous.
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Angel on Jan 02, 2008 05:41 PM Permalink
Shamita doesn't have any work I think! She's all over the place commenting with her ridiculous theories... haha
RE:RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by koblenz koblenz on Jan 02, 2008 07:14 PM Permalink
"blacks in america are fairer than those in somalia." TRUE, BUT because overwhelming blacks in America have some amount of European ancestry and thats the reason and not the over simplistic argument you are giving.
RE:RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:20 PM Permalink
In other words, why do countries which have minimal to no sun intensity have white skins and countries with fierce sun have darker skins.
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Robin Joseph on Jan 02, 2008 04:25 PM Permalink
are you trying to address my question of GOT FAIR ? or are you doing the tangential thing that you so like doing ?
RE:SHIVA PARVATI TALE
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 04:28 PM Permalink
what ha ha , dont be an ignorant idiot, Read about connection between melanin and hot sun and colour of the skin in wikipedia. LEARN something before opening your mouth.
Stay in Kashmir or Shimla for two months, and your skin colour will become fairer too.
When I lived in Himachal I was very much fair but then we all moved to UP and I have gotten dark.
RE:SO very true
by toyosha on Jan 02, 2008 03:44 PM Permalink
MAYBE INDIANS DON'T DESERVE ANY RESPECT, WHICH COUNTRY HAD 2 LADIES MOLESTED ON NEW YEARS EVE BY A MOB OF 60-70 PEOPLE, RIGHT IN THE BUSINESS CAPITAL OF THE 2ND MOST POPULATED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD. ANYBODY HEARD OF ANY SUCH OTHER CASE ? REAL DISGRACE TO MANKIND & SHAME ON THE EDUCATION, ETC ETC -I AM AN INDIAN ALSO, LUCKILY AWAY FROM THE DISGUSTED LIFE STYLE & LIVING STANDARDS OF INDIA
RE:SO very true
by on Jan 02, 2008 04:25 PM Permalink
Toyosha Hi! Come out of your shell. Look at the world at large. Find any country, big or small, developed or under developed, peopled by fair-skinned or dark-skinned, hindus or muslims, catholics or protestants or atheists (including China), where such incidents (condemnable as they are) do not happen. If you are an Indian, not living in India, I would say it is good riddance. May you never set your foot on our land.
RE:SO very true
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 05:22 PM Permalink
FACTS ARE FACTS. DOES PATRIOTISM MEAN BECOMING AN IGNORANT IDIOT AND BURYING HEAD IN THE SAND ? i have personally seen and see as part of daily life of an air hostess as to how RUDE AND HAUGHTY and snobby Indian tourists. Or I suppose you live in a small village and running your home kitchen only. I have travelled around the world as an Air Hostess in Lufthansa and I can testify Indian tourists are worst of the worst in behavior and etiguettes. Indian men are very very shameless and cheap in behaviouor as if they have never seen a women before, and that includes married and pot bellied 50 year old uncles who will try to grope a 21 year old Airhostess like me thinking they will just get away.
RE:SO very true
by toyosha on Jan 02, 2008 06:16 PM Permalink
sure there is too much s....around everywhere in india, no need to mess up my lovely shoes.
A very enjoyable and well written article describing in all its humour, the actual experience of an Indian in India!
It%u2019s funny but true... Goa tends to do that to people/waiters/urchins, even the person selling fake necklaces on the beach will look straight through your wheaty self and aim at the FIRUNGs walking about. Is it them or is it us?
Mostly it%u2019s us... Firangs are amongst the friendliest people you can meet (exceptions abound as much as the friendly and smart Indian teen does!) When they talk to you, then are not thinking that you are going to steal their wallet or drug them or glance at their wife/daughter/girlfriend etc etc. Genuine smiles, mostly genuine intent (relaxation!)
Looking at the Indian bunch that usually shows up, there is always the Fat-Balding-man-who-loves-to-ogle, the nosy-and-uptight-PYT, the-hunk-with-the-genuine-adidas-shorts,the-auntie-with-oranges-apples-water-juice-magically-stuffed-in-one-bag, the-really-loud-kids and some normal teens thrown in for dramatic effect!
Bad experience from one bunch tends to sour and characterize that group forever... are we getting somewhere?
But hey, you can recreate that special goan waiter magic in Bombay itself... goto a page 3 type party dressed in casuals and bask in the weird stares that you WILL get !
Had i been treated like this, i would hve published the name of the restaurant in this column. As well as written a letter to a local newspaper & published it in the paper. Made an appeal to people to boycott the restaurant. Asked the name of the waiter & also published the name. There are number of ways in which such scumbags can be taught a lesson. The problem is tht we keep quiet n express our discontent too mildly. You got every right to be harsh with these people. Trust me no good restaurant would like its name to be associated with bad service / discrimination. Had you done it, you would have done some good to the others who would meet a similar fate. By not making a fuss about it, you are actually sending a message that it is acceptable for indians to get treated like this.. This is the sad CHALTA HAI attitude...
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 03:08 PM Permalink
It wont work like this. That restraurent is a niche designed to cater to foreigners only. When you have 100% clientale who is foreign, you wont care. And the Indian tourist who goes there, must know that he is not a priority or target market.
For Indians, other hundreds of desi restruarents are open.
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by Kedar Kulkarni on Jan 02, 2008 03:34 PM Permalink
Target Market ,NICHE RESTAURANT .. MY FOOT!!!! .. Its money that matters honey .. aim of any business is to make money.. no matter WHO pays it ... Its a different matter that Indians are in AWE of white skin .. Also its equally true that INdians are worlds worst tippers and are horribly rude customers .. a combination of these tow factors is what creates such situations..
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by on Jan 02, 2008 03:39 PM Permalink
It's true that money is most important for any business and it doesnt matter who pays - indian or foreigner.
But if you cannot even call to make a reservation (because they judge your nationality by your accent) then where is the question of even getting the chance to pay?
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by Sajul on Jan 02, 2008 03:29 PM Permalink
"restraurent is a niche designed to cater to foreigners only"??? Sound more Like "Dogs and Indians not allowed". You are justifying racism!
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by on Jan 02, 2008 04:12 PM Permalink
How do you know "that restaurant is a niche designed to cater to foreigners only"? Is it a foreigner owned place and you own a share in it? Or are you a foreigner feigning an Indian sounding name?
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by abhijeet duge on Jan 06, 2008 02:38 PM Permalink
There are 2 issues here Issue 1: i don't think that you can "officially" have a niche restaurant designed to cater to foreigners only!! if someone has that policy, you can just sue it. N its not the question if its indian or a foreigner who is disciminating. The fact that you are being discriminated against. N you have every right to hit back. The best way is thro' a public forum where the reputation of the restaurant is put at stake. I've seen this working very effectively (not in india) even though i was not personally involved in it where the restaurant had to issue public apology for being discriminatory & they had to fire a gora manager. With TRP hungry media channels, this should work too very well in india... Issue 2: At the same time, i feel pretty sad to see a lack of civic sense displayed by many of my fellow countrymen in india as well abroad (seen many examples my self where i was dismayed at the actions of our desi friends). Our image everywhere has been formulated by our actions. and we need to seriously work on it for next few years in order to change it.
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by Robin Joseph on Jan 02, 2008 03:19 PM Permalink
Ahhh... now thats being a little dicy right there... Agreed that foreigners are a target market, but are you try to imply that the millions of NRI's and well off Indians are not a market in the first place... And also are the foreigners not welcome to desi restaurants cuz they are not PRIORITY !
haha... Arent you either doing or already completed a management degree (@Shamita)
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by on Jan 02, 2008 03:25 PM Permalink
Yeah I agree. The restaurant is in India and though it caters to primarily foreigners, a native Indian should also be welcome.
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by on Jan 02, 2008 03:07 PM Permalink
I completely agree. Instead of adopting a lying down attitude, we need to stand up for our rights. It is OUR COUNTRY and OUR RIGHT to get the treatment we deserve! I agree, the author should publish the name of the restaurant and defame it publicly because of its pathetic services.
RE:RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by Shamita on Jan 02, 2008 03:09 PM Permalink
If you read the article clearly, you will see it is INDIAN WAITER not foreigner owner who was treating with contempt.
Foreigner owner actually welcomes them and even apologized. DONT SPREAD HATRED.
RE:Why are you being so nice to tht restaurant
by on Jan 02, 2008 03:18 PM Permalink
When you talk about service in a restaurant it doesnt really matter who is ill treating you - whether a foreigner or an indian waiter. It is just bad service. Period. Just because the foreigner apologized it doesnt negate the ill treated meted out by the waiter. The very fact that the author has mentioned this incident is because of the ill treatment he received. When you get bad service from a place you need to complain about it. It is not about spreading hatred here - it is about knowing the difference between when to stand up for your rights and when to take it lying down.
